Post-Trade Analysis: All Good News for the Nets
by Net Income on Aug 13, 2010 2:00 PM EDT
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PrintThe basketball pundits are having their say on Wednesday's big four-team, five player deal, and they mostly think it was a big win for the Nets...and for some of the team's players, both old and new.
Kelly Dwyer of Yahoo! Sports gushes, "It turns out that [Billy] King, the much-beleaguered former 76ers boss, actually ran out of the gate with a fantastic move for his new team." Dwyer likes the deal for a lot of reasons: Troy Murphy's expiring contract is one but he also likes the way the 6'11" forward fits into Avery Johnson's system. "Stick this guy in a pick-and-roll game with Devin Harris? With a coach that doesn't mind a big power forward launching from deep? Sounds too good to be true."
Bradford Doolittle of Basketball Prospectus is similarly optimistic: "First, [Murphy] will give new coach Avery Johnson a floor-spacing big man to deploy alongside center Brook Lopez, a role Yi Jianlian was unable to hold down last season. Murphy's presence also means that Johnson won't have to rush raw rookie Derrick Favors into a role that he's not ready for."
Alex Raskin of HoopsWorld thinks with the trade, the Nets have a lot more weapons: "With Murphy and Travis Outlaw spreading the floor, and Terrence Williams and Harris penetrating from the perimeter, Brook Lopez should have his best year as a professional."
- A look at each side of the Hornets/Rockets/Nets/Pacers deal - Kelly Dwyer - Yahoo! Sports
- Transaction Analysis: Seven players, five teams, two trades - Bradford Doolittle - Basketball Prospectus
- Grading The Deal: Four-Team Trade Wakes NBA From Hibernation - Andrew Perna - RealGM
- Ranking the Atlantic Division - Alex Raskin - HoopsWorld
- TrueHoop round-table on Houston Rockets trade of Trevor Ariza - Rahat Huq - True Hoop
- A Pacers' Fan Says Farewell To Troy Murphy - Levy2725 - Indy Cornrows
- NBA At 2: Murphy's Law In NJ? - Bill Ingram - HoopsWorld
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NETS
are going to have a good season, but during the season what position will they look to improve?
SG
Morrow doesn’t really have the skillset to be a starter and TWill is much better suited for the three (even if Avery says he can’t/won’t play there).
With Murphy and Outlaw...
….out there to stretch the defense, it does not matter anymore. I look forward to seeing T-Will play the 2 guard once he and Harris develop some kind of chemistry when in together.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
The SF spot is definitely the one position where we need some improvement
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 13, 2010 2:49 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
ah
but who is to say that improvement cannot come from within?
Damion James’ development is going to be huge for this franchise.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I was going to bring this up
but the nets are going to use that cap don’t you think and if you were to trade someone from this roster who would it be?
depends on who is coming in return, and the circumstances JJ25
I’d trade for Anthony in a heartbeat and use any player outside of Lopez and Favors to get him. But i’m wary of these backdoor plans and deals that Anthony may have in place already so I wouldn’t trade for him unless an extension is agreed too
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
If Travis Outlaw
becomes Josh Howard and T-Will becomes Andre Igoudola there is no reason to get someone like Carmelo Anthony but if they don’t become something (good) they should get Melo. The bench is something special as well they should all improve, Morrow, Farmar and James. If Murphy does not re-sign and T-Will and Outlaw become borderline stars or close to stars they should sign Al Horford. Horford and Lopez and Favors for years to come minutes won’t be a problem 32 minutes each just like Odom, Bynum and Gausol.
Totally...
definitely want to see James thrive at the 3 – maybe even push to be a starter as the season progresses if he is an all round player. Very hopeful that he and Williams become an two-way wing tandem to be reckoned with. That is the fantasy anyway.
I liked...
….the idea of Williams and James being a wing duo when I watched them in summer league
I can’t wait to see James in some real game action. The dude is an animal
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Hopefully Damion James
Would wrestle the 3 spot away from Outlaw after 5-10 games if not the starting job at the 2 spot.
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 13, 2010 6:45 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
they didn't
pay Outlaw to be 6th Man or a bench player Avery must have ssen something he liked any will develope it.
agree
outlaw is a good player. yes, they overpaid but what do you expect? do you think players are dying to come to a 12-70 team?
i don't care if he was sign to a $35M contract
If Damion James is playing better than Outlaw after 5-10 games then James shouls start IMO.
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 13, 2010 8:14 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
makes no sense
you aren’t going to dump a 26 year old with a $35 million contract for a 23 year old after five to ten games. That is NOT going to happen.
who says about dumping?
If james is playing better than him then he should start not Outlaw. I didn’t say that trade/dump him after 5-10 games.
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 13, 2010 9:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
You are downgrading the guy
he hasn’t started one game in the season and you want to switch him in the starting lineup he’s starting I don’t know if you heard Avery would like a set lineup thru the all-star break. If the Nets are winning games with James coming off the bench its going to stay that way. James could be a stud don’t get me wrong but Outlaw had a nice 18ppg in 36mpg in 2007. And it could improve as he said he came here to get a chance to show what he’s got its just depressing when you say Hopefully James wrestles the 3 spot away from Travis, James is not a 2 and you should say hopefully Outlaw Averages 15 5 3 as a starter and make him worth 7 million and hopefully the Nets win some games.
What did you understand about 5-10 games?
I didn’t say start James on opening night. I said if James is playing better than Outlaw after 5-10 games then I think he should start not Outlaw. 2007 was 3 years ago so that doesn’t count. Avery said James could play the 2 guard. Hope outlaw average that but I do like Jamews better than him.
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 13, 2010 10:44 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Rememeber
its about the team Do you like the Nets or Damion James?
Of course I like the team
Do I have to say it again???
If Damion James is playing better than Outlaw after 5-10 games then James should start IMO.
simple….
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 14, 2010 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions
I think if he is playing better by halftime of the 4th game, he should start the 5th game.
(Do you get what I mean?)
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
I think if he is playing better by halftime of the 4th game, he should start the 5th game.
Yeah I get this one KV :) But that’s not what I said.
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 14, 2010 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions
The point is, just wait and see how Outlaw looks and what he does well. I have no idea how you came up with your game number.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
5-10 games
Simple. If Outlaw’s not playing well after 5 or 10 games then Avery should start DJames
“IF”James is playing better than Outlaw.
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 14, 2010 12:50 AM EDT up reply actions
I asked you how you came up with the number, not to restate what you said.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Aug 14, 2010 1:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Do I have to say the first five-ten games of the season too?
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 14, 2010 1:30 AM EDT up reply actions
I give up.....
What so hard to understand about five to ten games? Do I have to explain What is five and what is ten is? On how do I came up with five and ten? or what number is next after 5 is? or after 10?
"There's no way, with hindsight, I would've ever called up Larry, called up Magic and said, 'Hey, look, let's get together and play on one team,'"
by jasperjarrod on Aug 14, 2010 1:37 AM EDT up reply actions
cheers.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Aug 14, 2010 1:58 AM EDT up reply actions
I believe..
that what is kind of being said (not directly) is that your triigger finger is a bit too itchy. Wait, that’s not direct either.
I mean, 5 to 10 games is way too quick to consider theoretically pulling Outlaw as a starter. I think it would likely take longer, towards the end of the season maybe, and of course may only happen if James is playing better than Outlaw. You’d have to wait and see more Than 10 games for sure.
I don"t see this as a big problem being that Outlaw always has been a high level bench player. But on this team right now he definitely starts. I hope he does really well. Nets will need scoring from him. The competition for pt is great.
If Harris doesn't make good progress, I think it should be PG
Starting SF could be better
Backup C could be better as well
What if Outlaw
become Josh Howard and T-Will becomes Andre Igoudola would this team compete for a championship in years to come with Favors also becoming something special and use the cap to re-sign their own players or should they use the cap this offseason or during the season and trade someone like Outlaw or T-Will. Harris is well liked by Avery and would thrive with him as coach again and is the only all-star.
WOO HOO!
can’t wait for the season to start.
by jrtallent on Aug 13, 2010 2:35 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Troy Murphy
is a good fit. If he can just juice up his D a bit, and Avery sits Brook down with some D talk, it could work out really well. I just hope that other teams PF/C combo’s don’t blow by us. Because as it stands now, our interior D is non existent.
this is what i worry about
but we’ll have to wait and see.
We will own the boards though, especially with a line of Lopez/Murphy/Outlaw/Williams/Harris
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions
These guys are way too optimistic
The Nets look worse than last year now that they traded Lee.
[/sarcasm]
Anyway, all idiocy aside:
Alex Raskin of HoopsWorld thinks with the trade, the Nets have a lot more weapons: “With Murphy and Travis Outlaw spreading the floor, and Williams and Harris penetrating from the perimeter, Brook Lopez should have his best year as a professional. The third-year center from Stanford has the defensive and offensive skills to become an All-Star, and now he may have some complementary pieces to make that happen.”
This is what I have been saying ad nauseum.
Which is why some of the talk about this team, as if this is the same squad as last year, is utterly stupid.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
I get really upset
When I hear people who i’m arguing with go “but you won 12 games last year ..”
I’ve had this discussion w/ so many people on forums and in person it boggles my mind how so many simply don’t understand that last year means virtually NOTHING.
it makes it worse when nets fans do it
as if they don’t understand the circumstances surrounding last year’s team and how different EVERYTHING is going into this season
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly only thing the same is our name people have to get over that, but thats what the games are for
What makes me more optimistic than in past years is that a lot of the guys we have on our team are naturally talented, not guys who have to work 200% to stay i this league EX Antoine Wright.
these are SHOW ME people. They are the people who buy stocks after they have already gone up in value. Assume that A+B+C=D. You can quantify A+B+C, but they still won’t believe what D is until it happens.
by kiemurphy on Aug 13, 2010 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
perfect analogy dude
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
"That's exactly Right!!!"
Consequences will never be the same.
by NetsMets4Life on Aug 13, 2010 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions
rec'd
needed to be green. we’ll be much better than people think this season…. barring any injuries…. please god, don’t let there be injuries this season…
by JohnFromLongIsland on Aug 13, 2010 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Netsking and DollarBills right on target
I agree with everything both of you have said
The things people on here need to realize is were not going on this forum or others and saying were going to win 55 gms and go to the finals were saying this team could get to 40 wins and playoffs
Like one of my buddys (Magic Fan) says im a homer because i said to him i really believe 40-41 wins the nets can win and he calling me a homer, i dont get him i told him so many times how can you compare this yrs team to last yrs?, i just hate when people bring up what happened last season, the funny thing is most of us who know what the nets really are and what hte nets really needed to improve know that last yrs team wasnt no 12 win team we could have done alot better there were games were we played amazing but at the end of the day the better team won,
Let the games be played and lets see what happens, with these many new players who knows we can win 49 games with alot of WOOW on people faces or there can be a 19 win season, who knows we dont know its just prediction because if we win 45 games and go to the playoffs everyone on here (who doubts the nets) and everyone on espn will look stupid because they like to talk before even seeing the games being played
"Avery Johnson: Erase to Replace"
"Proky:Make Playoffs 2010-11 season"
by Wall2KingJames on Aug 13, 2010 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Dont know if there are any Giants fans here but im one of them and there a perfect explain, all i hear is the giants wont do good because there secondary sucks and they gave up the 3 most points in the nfl last season, but the thing people dont get is how can you compare TT,Rouse,Brown,Webster to TT,KP,Rolle,Webster like i dont know how can you compare the 2
Dont know if anyone knows BT from espn radio at 1PM but when he heard Boley said the giants could have the best Defense in the NFL he called him nuts and what did he bring up the giants gave up 400+ points last yr, these are the things that make me laugh how can you compare last yrs defense to this one
"Avery Johnson: Erase to Replace"
"Proky:Make Playoffs 2010-11 season"
by Wall2KingJames on Aug 13, 2010 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Brandon whateverhisname his on ESPN
is an IDIOT.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 14, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions
agree, put the past where it belongs...in the past
There were also a lot of games where the Nets went into halftime with the score being very close; even sometimes tied or ahead.
Then in the 3rd quarter they would have a mental meltdown, a few bad plays and the game was over with. I don’t see that happening much this year if any this season.
The mental game plan will be as important as the physical, maybe more. That is why it’s important in training camp to work on the intangibles as well as the tangibles.
i dont care what's on my face
I’m a fan and I want to see them succeed. This isn’t about who has the greatest predictive powers (obviously Mr. Dollar Bills does after last year). It’s about being hopeful.
It IS all new.
hahaha yep
I’m predicting 35 wins best case, 28 wins worst case just to cover my tail this season
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 14, 2010 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions
but the team has playoff potential. I see it
I just worry about health and defense really. We’re going to score though. Some opposing fans are in for a rude awakening when the 3 point bombs rain down on their team like Fat Man over Nagasaki
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 14, 2010 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions
This move just gives us time.
Right now we have a stop-gap and a project at PF. We’re better than last year but until they hit the court it’s hard to say where we stand.
It's going to take some time to gel
but the pieces are there to be competitive. At least it should be fun watching this year.
will the heat take time to gel?
if not why cant the nets gel and the heat can ?
"Avery Johnson: Erase to Replace"
"Proky:Make Playoffs 2010-11 season"
by Wall2KingJames on Aug 13, 2010 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Off topic but
Dwyer makes a great point about how absurd New Orleans is for making this deal. They’ll only realize how badly they’ve been screwed when Chris “LRMR” Paul hauls tail out of Louisiana leaving them holding the bag
If I was NO’s GM, you would have had to kill me and you would have had to toss my rotting corpse into the oil blackened waters of the gulf to pry Collison from my dead hands.
No way in heck do you trade a STUD pg like that on the whim’s of a dude that a)made a trade demand and b)allegedly disrespected your franchise by saying in public about how he was going to play for the Knicks.
And for an SF that is average at BEST. On a WHIM of a primadonna who thinks a championship should be wrapped up for him and delivered to his doorstep.
You all should be grateful that we are headed in the right direction. We should thank NO for being so bloody stupid.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
NO would have been better off trading CP3 + Posey and rebuilding
now NO has set itself back at least 5 years.
The trade didn't set them back now
but if Paul leaves, it will go down as a horrible mistake.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 14, 2010 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions
ouch
Quinton Ross(notes) can more than ably cover Lee’s role of defending well and not being very good on offense.
I actually agree with this. It sort of makes you wonder….how long has NJ wanted to trade Lee?
So a win-win, all-around. It might not put New Jersey in the playoffs, but they took one of the league’s worst starters last year and traded him for a need position, working heavy minutes at a well above average-rate. With an expiring contract, no less.
Yeah. We came away smelling like roses with this one
Welcome Troy!
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 3:20 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I keep forgetting Ross is even on this team...
He’s like Ann on Arrested Development… 
I totally agree with the quote, too. What Lee brought to this team is anything but unique. We won’t mis him. But really, losing Lee won’t mean much. The Rockets GM saying how much they “like” him sounds like any front office type praising a new acquisition publicly. Doesn’t mean a thing.
by JohnFromLongIsland on Aug 13, 2010 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Wow looks like Rockets may be moving Lee???
“The Rockets’ brass will say how much they like him, blah, blah, blah, but initially Lee’s biggest contribution to the team will be his salary, not his play,” Solomon writes.
I hope he goes to a playoff team.
If not, he’ll just be crying all over again.
that's his problem
I liked Lee as a roleplayer and a spot starter, and I commend him for keeping his mouth shut last year even though he did not want to be here, but he seems to have some kind of sense of entitlement.
You’re a professional. The only thing that he’s entitled to is that big fat paycheck. Suck it up.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Daryl Morey loves him
that real gm thing is bull and he cant be traded for 60 days unless its in a one-for-one.
http://www.netsdaily.com/2010/8/12/1619457/for-houston-the-trade-was-all
They are looking for a Star
Good young core Lowry, Lee ,Budinger, Hill, Hayes, Patterson and Taylor
Good Veteran Core Brooks, Martin, Battier, Scola, Yao, Jefferies and Miller
Yao might be done
I consider Martin a star caliber player.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions
It's one thing to discuss an superstar in the making, or a future all-star...
But it looks like Courtney Lee is gonna be a career journeyman before his rookie scale contract is up.
by JohnFromLongIsland on Aug 13, 2010 3:56 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He is Arron Afflao
good defender and good shooter.
Most of the time I can find something to like about a player
even if he’s not that good. But I never got an attatchment to CLee. I just thought he was better than he was. Shaq was hyping him like he couldn’t believe he got traded and I wanted to see what he did when he got his shot. He never made me feel like he was a legit starting SG. He’s a Raja Bell type player. he’s decent but you can find guys like him all over the league. He’ll look good playing spot minutes for a playoff team but that’s about it.
Come on
he played well for an NBA FInalist then disappointed with a team that was 12-70 and had a horrible coach and assorted injuries, scandals and the worst attendance in the league.
I would not in the least be surprised to see him do very well in Houston.
We don’t know how good he could be. Last year was not a test, a measurement.
That's what I saw
when I watched EVERY GAME… I didn’t see it. That’s me. I didn’t get a good vibe about him. He wasn’t a dead eye shooter, wasn’t real physical, not consistently good at any one thing. If he simply made his shots, the Nets would have been a different team. But they litereally had no one that could shoot. I thought the shooting guard should be ale to do that but hey that’s me. He didn’t fit what I thought was a starting SG. That’s why Morow is here. He may grow and mature, but from I saw it wasn’t there. I never watched a Nets game and thought he was our sg of the future. Even though the other players played under the same situation I could see Twill’s game developing. I could even see Yi’s upside from time to time. And Lee will have a hard time finding minutes on Houston.
all of which write about
was affected by a team that was horrible in every way imaginable.
The season was a disaster and not a test.
Of course it was a disaster
But I saw it as an opporunity for Lee to show his skill set. And other than good D, I don’t know what it was. I won’t miss him at all. And I doubt any Nets fans will shed a tear. He may turn out to good but he may also turn out to be a journeyman. He is headed toward journeyman right now..
No team could make a player look as bad as the 2009-10 New Jersey Nets. No structure, no coaching, no go to guy, no home court advantage, no veteran leadership (from a productive player), no commitment from ownership, etc. etc. Lee is a good player. Morey is smart to pick him up now, its a good stealth move for them. Lee will have a long and productive NBA career. I am guessing he stays with the Rockets for a long time.
pretty much
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions
in that same vein
Murphy is coming from a bad place as well. Indiana was a disaster and he admitted it was getting hard playing without hope of a playoff game. He currently leads the league in game without every experiencing the playoffs…621.
He had career high numbers last year, but his consistency is such that he doesnt really vary much.
Im suprised
the he did’nt come along with his sidekick Mike Dunleavy they been together their whole NBA careers. This is good to have a guy that gives his team consistent numbers throughout the season, his season high last year was 29 Avery Knows what to expect from him on a nightly bases not like Yi he could score 11 point then score 5 then score 18 then score …………and give 3res then 5 rebs then 7rebs then would suprise with 12rebs
I Can't See Lee...
Having a big year in Houston.
He’s stuck behind Kevin Martin a premier SG. He also cannot play PG or SF, as some article out of Houston recently suggested. But even if he could Houston has a crowded rotation.
Brooks / Lowry
Martin / Lee
Battier / Budinger / Jeffries
If Lee had an extra 2-3 inches, I can see him being as good as Rip Hamilton, but he guys is clearly undersized and limited in his versatility regardless of his size.
Already I saw another article from Houston that saw this deal for what it was.. a way to get out of Ariza’s contract, a way to lower payroll and tax, and possibly gearing up for a future trade.
Martin is injury prone
I’d make a healthy wager that Lee gets playing time and even a few starts in Houston
His shooting would benefit from Yao being on the block though
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions
The Rockets want a superstar, so if anyone is going to be traded there I would wager it to be Martin is some major blockbuster and in that case Lee would provide nice insurance for them as a guy they can start at SG. I don’t think people have said he could play PG and SF; they were saying he could guard PGs and some SFs. Guarding quick penetrating PGs might be what Lee does best and I think thats quite important in the NBA today because PGs have taken over the league and the rules play into their advantage.
Lee had the one year on Orlando with some bigtime plays, and after that he was expected to be amazing. Fact is, most players are just a product of their stars success and role playing. Lee is a role player, and when he applies himself to that position he is very good. This guy was never supposed to be a starter, he has some obvious head-case issues. Hey, he can do well with Yao like he did with Dwight Howard, but coming off the bench in spurts.
Initially
I was against trading Lee for a stopgap, even tho I wasn’t a fan of his (while valuing his strengths and what he brought to the team in terms of work ethic, I always thought he was very replaceable). He wanted out, so I’m perfectly OK with this move now. I wish him well. We got a very good PF. Hopefully troy will be more than just a stopgap. Hopefully he does great and we re-sign him.
this is how I feel bro
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 13, 2010 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Two points
every good team needs three good big men. The Nets could have those three good big men in Lopez, Murphy and Favors. They are complementary.
If he works out, the question is how much do you pay him because next summer, the Nets will need to decide how much they want to pay Brook Lopez.
They need to spend that money
before they give deals to Brook and T-Will I think Horford, Brook and Favors is a better Rotation for years to come and if Outlaw can be developed under Avery Just like Howard was (all-star) and T-Will becomes what half of this site thinks he is going to be there is no reason to get Melo. They should spend that Money on Horford Atlanta can’t afford him and Murphy is 31 by next year.
Damion James I think will be better than Outlaw
Looks to be a better shooter is tougher and better defender.
Ok that was'nt my point
If James, Outlaw, Morrow or T-Will become something big there is no need for Carmelo and you can sign a young big in Horford because the hawks can’t afford him instead of signing Murphy for two years then what he is washed up and the nets are stuck with this team for years to come and can only hope Favors and Draft picks will save them?
I see what your saying
But Hortford isn’t coming here to be a backup, we get a chance at Carmelo you take it, outside of Durant he’s probably the best pure offensive player in the league, James,T-will and Morrow might be something special but not on his level offensively.
Who said backup
last time I checked Favors isn’t readt till 3 years he would be the Starting Power Forward if you haven’t heard he is a Power Forward not a Center.
Last time you checked??
We haven’t even played a regular season game yet, he might be ready before the season is over.
Its not like that
man he won’t get better in 3 months they said three years everyone has said it don’t try to lower it.
I don't make him be nothing
its all said by the team and before he was drafted he hasn’t played one NBA game.
I didn't say you make him sound like nothing.
But that 3-year development is way too long for a guy drafted as the 3rd overall pick with this coaching staff around him.
Key Word You
Did you re-read that comment. When DF was drafted I said the same thing man 3 years is way too long I agree but I didn’t say it the Scouts say it and did you read the article Net Income did on Favors he is still Raw he does not have a go to move<that is not good his defense needs to improve his body still needs work Dwight Howard body is nowhere near when he enterd the league that body is what makes Dwight Howard he only has two go to move a simple post up and the running hooks his body is what makes dwight draw all those fouls and get easy buckets trust me I saw every single Magic game, Brook has a better well rounded game than Dwight on Offense and a jump shot. And DF doesn’t have a consistent Jumper. He needs to develope moves his Kness and Legs are going to give up on him fast if all he does is dunk on people.
I assume Brook will get the max
especially if he has the season that I am predicting from him now with the floor spread.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 14, 2010 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
also agree
i was surprised that everyone was mentioning him as a one year guy and then a salary drop for next year. if he puts up numbers like he has before…and helps us get into the post-season, why NOT sign him again?
by lennythegreat1 on Aug 13, 2010 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions
let's hope so!
It would be a sign that he played great and helped the team. I think he has 3-4 good years left in the tank. Two of his best three seasons as a pro were the last 2 ones.
especially if we get him at a decent price
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 14, 2010 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Damn I just read the Yahoo article
They kinda tore into Lee, saying he was one of the worst starters a step above Hassel Yikes.
Yup
you couldn’t depend on lee for anything really. NI thinks everybody should get a pass for last year because of the situation. I don’t. I think he still could have shown what he could do. he wasn’t a scub but was by no means a starting SG in the NBA.
everyone SHOULD get a pass
by no means a starting PG in the NBA? Right, he was only the starting PG on an NBA FInalist his rookie year.
if everyone gets a pass, then you'd welcome back the same Nets team for another round?
i thought not
An NBA Finalist that relied heavily on their front court, was plagued with injuries, and lost in the Finals. Rafer Alston was the starting PG of that team. NOBODY is ringing his phone to play this season. What happened in Orlando that season means as much as what happened in NJ last season. Houston will be Lee’s third team while on a rookie contract. Streaky players with a dash of defensive ability are a dime a dozen. You give him way too much credit.
by JohnFromLongIsland on Aug 13, 2010 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
please
he played very well and won the role. Enough denigrating him.
Everyone deserves a pass after last year.
Murphy abused the Nets as a Pacer
I remember watching this guy like, why can’t we have a reliable shooting big man like this? He’s a great addition. Nets will actually be able to put up some numbers this year. This guy is not going to be a Bobby Simmons, he will produce.
Simmons is without a doubt the worst deal I can remember for the Nets. Rodney Buford had more bang for the buck, even Buck Williams would’ve had more bang for the buck at his age now.
Billy King did good, and even if they get rid of him in a trade down the line this year, or release him next summer- this guy WILL score AND rebound.
Mutombo was pretty bad
i think one reason that Thorn liked Billy King is that King outdealt him twice, paying $140,000 for the pick that became Kyle Korver and dealing Mutombo away. Mutombo averaged 12 and 12 for his career prior to that trade and then 6 and 6 for the rest of his career. The rules changes in 2001 killed his effectiveness and he was getting paid far more than he was worth.
Nets had alterior motives in the Mutombo trade, namely a salary dump. McCullough was basically injured for the remaining 4 yrs of his contract and KVH also had an extra yr on his contract is relation to Mutombo. This allowed the Nets to re-sign RJ and Collins in the offseason in which Mutombo’s contract expired. Thorn was not out dealt here. And how was he outdealt in the Korver transaction? The Nets were in full on blow up the team mode at that point. He may well have been mandated to sell the pick.
full on blow up the team in 2003?
No. They were were full on blow up the team in 2004, when they sold the rights to Viktor Kryapa in the first round.
It was a DUMB trade and it was NOT a salary dump. The Nets had just lost to the Lakers in the Finals in June and then in early August, the Nets traded KVH and Big Todd for a guy who they thought would help them get past Shaq. Wrong. The Lakers didn’t make to the Finals.
Moreover, the $30 million Mutombo buyout was (and is) the largest buyout in the history of the NBA. It is an admission of a HUGE mistake. Billy King made the salary dump because he realized with the rules changes, Mutombo was done.
Big Todd was misdiagnosed. At the time of the trade, people thought he had plantar faschiitis, not a hereditary foot condition. He went into arbitration with the NETS, not the SIXERS, and won millions.
So how do you guys see the east playoffs shaping up??
I have:
miami
orlando
boston
bucks
chicago
atlanta
nj
ny
I wouldnt be surprised at all if ATL drops out of the race and is replaced by Detroit or Cha.
I think this team will Gel rather quickly and if they buy into Avery’s defense especially Brook, Outlaw and Twill, we can make some serious noise.
We have never had a team this deep since the Finals teams.
If Troy can do what he has done his whole career on this team i see us easily making the postseason.
LOCKS (barring injuries)
Miami
Orlando
Boston
Chicago
Atlanta
Milwaukee
NO
Cleveland
Toronto
Washington
That leaves…
MAYBE (in my order of probability)
NY – should do well, and expectations are high
Detroit – my dark-horse in the East – T-Mac and Monroe and a healthy team could be good
NJ – don’t want to jinx them, but still don’t know if they are there
Charlotte – I think they regressed. No Felton, no draft pick, no major acquisitions
Indiana – Adding a PG helps, but now no PF
Philly – Too young and too many pieces that don’t seem to fit
by Jack Handy Jr on Aug 13, 2010 8:09 PM EDT up reply actions
on an unrelated note…. if melo leaves the Nuggets, id be happy to do a sign and trade that could get Outlaw’s salary off our hands..
But what if Travis Outlaw
becomes Josh Howard and T-Will puts up good numbers there is no reason to get someone like Carmelo Anthony but if they don’t become something (good) they should get Melo. The bench is something special as well they should all improve, Morrow, Farmar and James. If Murphy does not re-sign and T-Will and Outlaw become borderline stars or close to stars they should sign Al Horford. Horford and Lopez and Favors for years to come minutes won’t be a problem 32 minutes each just like Odom, Bynum and Gausol.
Horford is retricted, i believe, and if the hawks would pay Johnson the max, then im sure they will keep Horford. Also, Favors would have to come off the bench in such a scenario and i would like to see him to start.
How many years has Outlaw been in the NBA? I have absolutely no idea so idk if he still has room to improve or any potential. I just hope his bloated salary will prove to be worth it
For that same reason think about it
JJ was paid big money, they aren’t a big market team they don’t get alot of attendence and they have Crawford as a free agent as well if they don’t look like a challege this year they might end up trading everyone and rebuilding Proky has big Pockets he wouldn’t mind giving 15 million to Horford TO WIN. Murphy is not 24 years old he might be done in a couple of years while Horford still has at leat 8 years under his belt when Murphy is done the Nets can no longer get another big without breaking up that core they have to respect the salary cap (Re-sign Brook and T-Will by then) after this year they would have about 20 million in cap 15 million to Horford Favors isn’t ready till 3 years they would have 5 million in cap left for draft picks they would now have a set team for years to come at least 6 years. Think of Horford as Security if Favors never delopes into something big and if he does you have the best three bigs in the whole league and Outlaw could develope as he said he has something to prove and is now a starter and T-Will looks like he can have a bright future. If they get Horford, Harris is the oldest player at 28 years old.
Lopez/Petro
Horford/Favors/Pick
Outlaw/James
Williams/MorrowPick
Harris/Farmar
We Have A Much Bigger Need
On the wings.. or at least we should.
Otherwise what was the point in Favors?
And I do see the need for 3 quality bigs, but we need at least 1 AS caliber wing.
by Jack Handy Jr on Aug 13, 2010 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Even if Outlaw and T-Will or James and Morrow become
All-Star caliber
What are the chances of that?
I’d say Lopez and Favors have a much higher chance of being ASs than Outlaw, Morrow or T.Will
Horford would be locked up for 5 years at a young age with Favors.
We need to lock up that money at the 2 or 3.
by Jack Handy Jr on Aug 13, 2010 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions
How is having
3young talented bigs locked up for 5 or 8 years thats a good thing you know the NBA CHAMPS won with 3 dominant bigs right or Wrong?
i dont wanna have a star PF like Horford if Favors can be better. i would rather have a vet take that time till hes ready. Murphy fits the bill nciely
people thought Lopez would take a while
he didnt start until Boone got hurt in game 7, then put up 25 points.
Lopez was a year older than Favors is now. I dont expect him to start right away or in game 8, but I do think you will see him play minutes at the 4 and the 5.
If Travis Outlaw improves, that just increases his value making Denver more willing to accept him in a trade.
Just sayin.
But I’m surprised you wouldn’t want Melo if both Travis and Terrence improve.
Oh yeah
I would Swap Outlaw for but the Question is does he have his mind set up where he want to go New York?
lots of options
and at some point the Nuggets will give Melo a deadline to sign that contract. If he doesn’t they WILL trade him, PERIOD. They have no choice.
Take a look at that roster after this year. He would be gone, KMart would be gone, J.R. Smith would be gone, Billups has a buyout of $3.7 million, Nene has a player option. They would HAVE to rebuild and so they would want the things the Nets have: picks, young players on reasonable contracts, expiring contracts in Hump, Murphy, and Ross, and cold hard Russian cash.
But the Nets
would not do it they have no security he stays.
Do you think
the Nets could keep him if they got him.
It's possible. But that's pretty much what this discussion is about..
all the possibilities. which drives me crazy sometimes. I just want the season to start. lol
I would give Outlaw
Hump, Ross and a Pick at most.
the Warrior pick in 2012 is interesting.
protected only 1-7 in 2012, 1-7 in 2013 and 1-6 in 2014.
That’s light protection.
So the team is pretty much set, and i like what i see. Its been a rocky road this offseason, but the Murphy deal suddenly helps everything fall into place.
Unless there is another surprise trade then 3 pieces could still change Uzoh, Zoubek and May. If it was a game of scrabble i would keep Zoubek, then Uzoh, but i don’t look good for May.
I would keep Uzoh before Zoubek
Uzoh looks like a nice prospect, also if injury’s happen at the guard position we can play Farmar at the 2 and so on, while Zoubez is really just 6 fouls and some rebounds.
Farmar is not a two.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Aug 13, 2010 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions
unless he's in the backcourt with TWill
Farmar is a much better shooter than Terrence. So he would move over to shooting guard. I’m making passing reference to this in my fanpost, which I hope to post tomorrow or Sunday fingers crossed I’m a slow writer.
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
Farmar is a much better shooter than Terrence. So he would move over to shooting guard.
Then he probably won’t be in the back court with TW. He isn’t a very consistent stand still shooter. Its just not his game (and he hates it). He has streaky months, but he goes cold too. From what he seemed to be told when signed, he is “running the show” when he is on the court.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
I say keep both
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 14, 2010 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions
UGH Reversible jerseys??
Are the Nets kidding? Just went on the main website and clicked on the 10-game plan being promoted and they are offering those stupid reversible jerseys again for the HEAT game! I figured that getting out of the meadowlands would be enough to rid ourselves of that ridiculous promotion..and why in the world would we do it for the Miami game which would have sold out EASILY without this gimmick. Disgusting..
Times like this I hate Yormark
They just spent a bundle on new players… market THEM you idiot!
Let's put to rest all those rumors that LeBron's and Jay-Z's relationship has soured
http://twitter.com/KingJames/status/21022711087
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
What row is he in?
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
interesting
I’d just like to know if Jay Z knew well in advance that Lebron was going to Miami.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Aug 14, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
The reversible jerseys make me sick
but it looks like its only when they play the Heat. What do you guys think the crowd’s reception of the Heat will be on Halloween?
The bandwagon fans are probably going to totally overpower the real Net fans’ booing…
i think avery
is the guy responsible for all the off-season moves. thorn knew he wanted to go run another team so he most likely (in good faith) made sure avery either okayed the deals- most likely avery was actively initiating them for players he liked/wanted. king was brought in as an understood pawn for and handpicked by avery. so for better or worse i think this is a little general assembled team. have to say, if i’m right, i’m pretty impressed w/ AJ’s moves
imagine something extremely witty here
four of the five big additions
said specifically him being the coach was a big factor for them: Farmar, Outlaw, Petro and Murphy. Morrow didnt say it so specifically but said nice things about him.
He will look good working the floor with D James (a.k.a the real James)
I think he will out play Outlaw for the starting 3. Maybe not at first but during the season I think we will see James minutes increase as the season progresses.
Since the face been revealed the game got real
22 to 27
This makes us a 27 win team, though competitive. A couple of more moves and playoffs could be a possibility.
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