Whitewash! "Blueprint for Greatness" Goes Down
by Net Income on Jul 30, 2010 10:31 AM EDT
in 2010 Free Agency
257 comments
The Nets only leased the side of the building at 34th and 8th for a month and over the last couple of days, workmen have all but covered the iconic images of Mikhail Prokhorov and Jay-Z with whitewash.
Did it work? Well, it didn't attract any free agents (unless any of the Little Four happened to drive by). On other hand, it got a lot of publicity and signaled the Knicks that the Nets are not content to be No. 2 in the city. It may have helped sell some of the 2,200 season ticket packages the Nets have sold this summer.
And as far as we know, Prokhorov did not buy the building, as he suggested he might when meeting with the beat writers a couple of weeks ago.
- 'Blueprint' billboard removed - Marc Stein - ESPN
- In Support Of LeBron? - Sekou Smith - NBA.com
- Mikhail Prokhorov LeBron James Letter - David Helene - Sports Grid
- Mikhail Prokhorov, Stereotype Buster - Sam Levin - New York Observer
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I think all of us at NetsDaily should pool our $ together and...
Put up a huge mural of TWill with his Barney back pack and purple socks on, while wearing a T-Shirt with A shot of a Young Avery from his early playing days.
There would be a quotation bubble coming out of Avery’s mouth saying: "It’s all new!’ and TWill would just have his thumbs up and a big smile.
Or a 50 foot mural of Johan Petro with a quotation bubble that says: “It’s all who?”
by Jron on Jul 30, 2010 10:36 AM EDT reply actions 6 recs
You wouldn't be able to use the Barney back pack
That’s a copyrighted image. Would be stupid for Prokhorov to pay for a license to use that image. Would also be silly to sanctify TWill’s more eccentric behavior via a billboard. All in all, a bad idea.
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
I don't think he was serious
and it’s spongebob, not barney
Barney is before T-Will’s time
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions
My guess would be Yormark
-Say man when I was growing up we wanted a Jacuzzi, we had to fart in the tub.
Well, that didn't go as planned necessarily
We struck out on all those big free agents but if I can look at the silver lining, Prokhorov has people talking about the team in a positive light, which NO ONE was doing in the past three or so years. And going into free agency, we had to be realistic. Not many people would want to sign with a team that just won 12 games. Let’s keep up the patience game and wait for Brook, Favors, and the rest of the roster improve this season.
by Greg Brzozowski on Jul 30, 2010 10:45 AM EDT reply actions
Diagree
“Horrible horrible” was Rather’s era. It’s all new now! And some fans still can’t hold their heads up… It will change soon. Very soon.
by Belarus4life on Jul 30, 2010 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Horrible would have been
If they went out and signed a bunch of overpaid free agents in order to compete with the Knicks. I thought the ad was an attempt to create some buzz entering free agency and it worked.
I think Nets fans are forgetting where we have come in a year. A year ago this time, Brooklyn was going nowhere, Ratner was losing money, our team was selling off all useful parts, and we were moving towards a twelve win season.
The blueprint for greatness has begun. In one year we hired a top head coach, drafted two good young players (one with superstar potential), filled out our bench rather cheaply, have help on to cap space, draft picks and other assets, not to mention we are moving into new arena with another on the way.
and, oh yeah, we were bought by one of the richest most exciting owners in sports. If we show as much improvement over the course of this year we will be well on our way. I’m exciting for this season and believe that we will be competing with the Knicks before long. I like our blueprint more than theirs.
by gsloots on Jul 30, 2010 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions 9 recs
i rec'd this
because it needs to turn green
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions
GREEN
Ask and DollarBills shall receive
-Say man when I was growing up we wanted a Jacuzzi, we had to fart in the tub.
Exactly!!!
That’s what I’m Saying. Anything that requires a blueprint to begin with usually doesn’t produce overnight. It’s a process. And we are progressing.
The NETS are coming!
Our players do seem humble
and they should coming off a 12 win season. It is our coach and owner who are brash and trying to inject some life into the franchise. The real basketball fans want to see improvement on the court and that is fair. This whole project will go nowhere if we don’t win games – Prokhorov knows that as well. The casual fan and New Yorker will take noticing of marketing and headlines and Prokhorov has brought more headlines than when we were in the Finals with Kidd. Rome wasn’t built in a day and the fact that he has allowed management to do their job is even more encouraging.
IMO.
by gsloots on Jul 30, 2010 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
the fact that Prokho...
….did not jump off of the bridge like some folks here have done in demanding that he max out David Lee, is encouraging to me.
There were two men that were worth spending top dollar for. Doing the same for Boozer, Stoudemire, or Lee would have been the definition of epic fail
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
David Lee is getting paid only 10.5 million for his first year at Golden State. That is a far cry from Maxing Out at 17+ million as people like to say.
And Nets were likely bidding around 50 million for 5 years for the 30 year old Scola, less than 2 weeks later (not to mention 40 million over 5 years for the problem child, Tyrus Thomas).
And getting DLee would have limited Knicks ability to rebuild, as well has helped Proky to keep his prediction of getting David Lee (or Boozer) and converting Knicks fans to Nets fans.
Fact is that Golden State just showed DLee more respect than the Nets, who also were talking with Lee’s agent daily, but didn’t show the same respect.
I think if they had to do things over (knowing that everyone else would reject Proky), they would have done things differently.
The Nets did not offer Scola a contract
and getting David Lee to prevent the Knicks from getting players is not a good basketball move. We don’t make moves while worrying about other teams bro.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions
and the money that we offered to Thomas basically went to Outlaw
shrugs
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Outlaw was signed BEFORE Thomas - don't you remember? And I never said Nets offered Scola a Contract - You are using NI's reasoning that if it isn't in writing it doesn't have any significance.
NI has to defend the Nets moves; Nets Fans don’t.
It was written at the time that Nets were the only team bidding with Houston. Houston would not have overpaid Scola if the Nets weren’t already bidding in the same range.
There is the remote possibility that Thorn was playing games with Houston by bidding up the price so that Houston would be crippled financially – but then what motivation would a retiring Thorn have to do that??
ah
you’re right, i did forget about that(the thomas offer).
Seems like the plan has changed though. Glad that it did.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Scola I didn't get
but Thomas made complete sense to me. It was another young piece that would have complimented Brook with defense and athleticism. You can disagree on that, but it was an organizational decision. Avery wanted him, Thorn put a price on what he was worth (which may have been more to the Nets than other teams). His price got to high and the Nets let him go, it wasn’t like the Nets were trying to force anything.
On the Scola front, I didn’t get the decision to offer him a contract or to negotiate.
Well..its not that the price got too hight for TT
the bcats made a higher offer.. and TT never got back into contact with nets mgm.
Some can argue that he used the Nets as a bargaining tool.
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
However, it is reasonable to conclude that neither Scola nor TThomas wanted to play for Nets.
That isn’t unusual to want to stay with the same team, but the media has the right to conclude that Proky/Thorn had failed to attract them. Likewise for Boozer/DLee. Perhaps in all cases it was because that they would all have been warmups for Favors.
true
The team cant control if another player wants to stay at home. Same things happened last year with Grant hill and J kidd with the knicks.
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
Both Scola and T Thomas were RESTRICTED!!!
That doesn’t mean they didn’t want to play here. Their teams matched the deals and held the cards. Stop with the woa it’s us stuff.
The NETS are coming!
There were no formal offer sheets so the teams never had to match the deals.
The players accepted the offers by their teams, at their own discretion. Their agents could have encouraged the Nets to put their highest offers in writing, if the 2 players really wanted to come to the Nets.
+1000
Golden State is paying David Lee 82 Million over 5 years and they gave up 3 players to get him.
I think Jerry just wants a white PF…lol. Between the we should have given the farm to David Lee to we need to trade T-Will or Devin or brook for Troy Murphy…lol. It’s like you still haven’t gotten over Van Horn.
The NETS are coming!
Totally False Once Again
In the future it might be helpful to Bookmark the following site so that you can see all the rosters and player salaries before commenting incorrectly:
http://www.storytellerscontracts.com/
David Lee went to Golden State in a Sign & Trade by his own choice, even though he had no good reason to help out the Knicks (which is what he did). Had Nets showed David Lee more respect by Proky meeting with him instead of waiting at some Hotel before his Jet went back to Moscow, he might have accepted the lower Nets offer (can’t prove what they were offering, but they were discussing it every day in the News and the well connected David Adridge predicted that Thorn was about to sign David Lee the day after Boozer signed with Chicago.)
Nets would have given up ZERO players to get Lee at that time, for a 5 year contract that could have started at 12-13 million. He instead signed a SIX year contract for 79.6 million (not 82), with salaries of 10.5, 11.6, 12.7, 13.8, 14.9, 16.0 million each year. Obviously Nets would have loved to have David Lee for those first few years, if they were willing to consider Scola (another White guy as you like to make this about Race) for big money.
And Nets probably wouldn’t have to give up any decent players to rent Troy Murphy for 1 season in order to become a playoff contender. Nets have leverage because they may soon be the only team that could absorb his $ 12 million salary, besides having lots of picks.
The Nets didnt like Lee that much
I know that’s hard for you to realize, but they NEVER EVER made him an offer.
ONCE AGAIN, NOT MAKING A FORMER OFFER IS NO INDICATION THAT NETS DIDN'T LOVE DLEE.
Obviously they were going down the line from LeBron and company, to Boozer, who was their next choice (they were only interested in Bosh in order to get LeBron).
At that same time that Thorn was finally attempting to recruit Boozer, Golden State and other teams were actively way ahead of Thorn in seeking to attract DLee. The price tag had already risen to 80 million over six years by Golden State.
When Boozer signed much earlier that Thorn had expected (before LeBron made his decision), Thorn was already at a disadvantage in getting DLee as his pricetag for a 5 year deal was mentioned to be 76 million by his agent, in one Tweet.
Maybe that was a little rich, but the night after Boozer signed, DLee’s agent was Tweeting late into the night – likely with Rod as one of the GMs trying to stay in contention. Why do we assume this – because reports came out that Thorn was talking to Lee’s agent daily. Also David Aldridge said that Thorn would have no choice but to take DLee.
So as you see, Rod couldn’t make a formal offer because he ran out of time as his pricetag got too high for Thorn’s thrifty thinking.
That is totally different from saying he didn’t want DLee.
Actually, it is done in baseball, where one of the reasons the Yankees sign a pitcher, for example, is to prevent Boston from getting that pitcher. The media will say those things, even if it can't be proven.
Only difference is salary cap in basketball.
Proky predicted Nets would get DLee or Boozer. Nets fans were posting continuously that if they can’t get LeBron, take DLee. Proky had stated that he wanted to convert Knicks fans to Nets fans and getting DLee would have done that in 2 ways (including preventing Knicks from doing a S&T).
Golden State just out hustled Thorn and Proky in the end. Why can’t you admit that?
As I said before, if they had to do things over, they would have made sure to get David Lee (since Boozer was beyond convincing). The media would be playing the Nets as winners of the off season and Knicks as losers, instead of the reverse.
All well and Good on that...
But why lock a guy up for 6 years and 79.6 mil when you just used a #3 overall pick on a guy who plays the SAME position???
We are fans here. ALL OF US. We can speculate until the end of time but unless I see a clip of a player saying one thing or the other it is what it is.
Did David Lee get the Knicks into the playoffs…. EVER? NO…
Do you think David Lee now puts Golden State over the TOP? NO again.
Would David Lee put us over the top? NO
If Lee were as good as you claim he would be in Miami right now and not Golden State.
Thanks for the contract link tho. That clears up a lot…lol. But you seem like a person who just wants to spend money to spend money. In this Economy its better to spend Wisely.
The NETS are coming!
The Nets would have gotten DLee for 5 years and between 70-76 million, depending on how good a recruiting job they did. If not for the Warriors they might have succeeded around 70 million, even without better recruiting.
70-76 million would be in the 12-13 million starting range, just as predicted before free agency.
David Lee would most certainly have guarantee the NETS would be in the playoffs for each of his years on the team.
Without him on the Knicks, they never would have won 12 games last year, when he had his best season (gets better every year).
If GS was in the East they probably WOULD make the playoffs. Hopefully in 2011-2012 he will help enough for GS to not be one of the 7 worst teams (since Nets own their 1-7 protected 1st round pick in 2012).
And to answer your main question – Every contending team needs 3 very good Bigs (as NI also writes). In 3 years hopefully Favors will also be in that category. Both Favors and Lee should be able to play minutes at Center. That means that you would be dividing 96 minutes among 3 players, or 32 minutes per player.
That is Not too much and that IS WHY Nets did pursue Boozer very actively, Lee actively, and TThomas and Scola actively, all for 5 year deals. There is evidence for willingness for Nets to have any of those five, and we won’t know how close Nets came to getting it done.
Now they have the chance to take a stopgap starting level Center for just 1 year, with Troy Murphy (Molasses if you wish) as the most likely candidate, IMO)
To put it simply
we absolutely 100% time 8 billion did the right thing in not signing boozer or DLee. Guys who think about the future understand that
Does anyone know how much the Nets paid for that one-month Billboard?
Also, Nets have been advertising steadily on NBA TV, with their All New campaign.
The Nets need to continue to do a better job at letting the rest of the Nation understand that they will be playing just a few miles from Madison Square Garden and in a State-of-The-Art Arena.
It appears that the opposition has successfully tarnished the Nets with the Newark name. ESPN has contributed and some free agents appear to have bought into that negative image.
One solution would be to rename the team, while playing in Newark, possibly to the Brooklyn Nets or New Jersey-Brooklyn Nets in the interim.
Otherwise, making the playoffs this year should be the best way to improve the image.
LOL
Failed.
I dont believe the idea that it was put up to signal the knicks that they arent subsiding to #2 in NY. The nets NEVER have took the back seat… not willingly. So the idea that the ad was to show that is blah.
Nothing but a waste of a multi billionaires money. No prob prokov right?
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
by semsemma on Jul 30, 2010 10:46 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
the only epic fail that I see here...
….will be when the Knicks hit year 3 of Amare Stoudemire’s contract
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
to each her own i guess
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
if you say so, ma'am
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
ha
you giving me superiority? what has this Net world come to? Money on trees? Paychecks for not going to work? gas stations paying me to give me gas? Nets making playoffs this year?
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
waste of money???
Eddy Curry > Blueprint of success billboard
Stephon Marbury > blueprint of success
could keep going down the list, maybe through thomas in there
wait...
…you’re a Knicks fan, and you’re talking trash about the Nets not making the playoffs?
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions
whats with you guys and reading what's written
this year?
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
oh
are the Knicks making the playoffs this year?
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
yessirrrrrr!! lol. u know it
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
good luck
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions
paychecks for not going to work?
sounds like obamanomics
Not a waste of money
We have to raise our expectations.
by Rawdawg05 on Jul 30, 2010 10:48 AM EDT via mobile reply actions 1 recs
this
at first i was ticked off because we didn’t get Lebron but now that the truth is out, there’s no reason to be mad
The Nets are thinking big.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions
not really
more people talked about the nets negatively
people were using that billboard and saying. “The Knicks don’t even know where the Nets play” Wilburn from PTI
then you have newspapers saying after the free agents and signings “was that blueprint for success”
Then on around the horn basically everyone was saying how bad is a team that you don’t put up the players.
We should just stay humble and go that route.
by killa kadafi191 on Jul 30, 2010 10:48 AM EDT reply actions
Who cares what ESPN Has to Say?
Since when have they ever said a good thing about the Nets or the state of New Jersey for that matter? This was a good idea, I just don’t understand why they only leased the ad for the building for only a month. Keep it up there for a couple of months. We all know Proky has the money for it. It’s a perfectly good idea. At least it shows the team is taking some form of initiative; this is probably the most bold move the Nets marketing team has made in…well, probably ever. And the fact that they were able to sell 2,000+ season tickets at least is a sign that some of their marketing schemes probably worked. I thought this was a great idea when it first came out, and I still think it is. But they should have done more to keep it up.
"We aim above the mark to hit the mark." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson
"We're looking at hiring the Red Army choir to perform at half-time along with Russia's top dancing bear collective." -Mikhail Prokhorov
"Don't worry about my cap" - Lou Lamoriello
ESPN is no longer a legitimate news outlet
I stopped watching sportscenter and their programming after what transpired this summer. I get my news via the net and for my NFL news i go right to the source, the NFL Network.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions
ESPN is a "news" outlet?
When was it ever? It was built on highlights and analysis of games, which it still does. People and their delusions of grandeur about ESPN and any entertainment journalism…
I’ve covered the movie, video gaming, and music industries as a “journalist.” Those fall into the category of entertainment journalism. I would put sports in that category too.
About 5% of all entertainment journo news is actually done by investigative reporting.
95% of entertainment journo news is basically just re-printed press releases from public relations professionals.
by Anthony Perez on Jul 30, 2010 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions
People tune in to sportscenter to find out the latest news in the world of sports
That is a fact.
Whether or not ESPN is being honest with what they report or not is another story entirely
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
And what they report is 90% reliant on press releases
People check out Variety to find out the latest goings-on in the movie industry, but most of the information is willingly fed to them.
Millions of people log-on to GameSpot.com to find the latest news about videogames, but (and I know from personal experience) 99% of that news is hand delivered by e-mail from PR reps earlier in the morning.
For all its faults, ESPN is a byproduct of the way the entertainment business works as a whole.
by Anthony Perez on Jul 30, 2010 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
They'll know
When Barkleys is finished and is better than their self proclaimed mecca of basketball.
this is important:
it’s not Barkley’s Center. Barkley’s Center is what forces him to buy size 42 belts.
People talk that trash
Yet, what has been the head to head record between the Knicks and Nets in the past 10 years?
Who has been to the NBA Finals in the past 10 years?
Who has won more games in the past 10 years?
And I’m willing to bet cash that we’ll smack them this year.
I remember when the Knicks were crying like girls because they were getting roughed up in the 1st round by K-Mart and Jason Collins. There will be more beatings soon to come. The Knicks should be embarrassed that they got blown off of the floor by a 12 win team last year. Try to ingest those eggs, cowards
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I’ve heard rumors that Jason Collins haunts Madison Square Garden in a bed-sheets style ghost outfit every time the Nets come over for an away game at MSG. Scared?
"We aim above the mark to hit the mark." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson
"We're looking at hiring the Red Army choir to perform at half-time along with Russia's top dancing bear collective." -Mikhail Prokhorov
"Don't worry about my cap" - Lou Lamoriello
Tim Thomas still feels the pain in his back...
….of being slammed to the floor like a rag doll
We need to get back to that.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions
GO BROOKLYN!!!
My sentiments exactly. I don’t think anyone was more happy to see Jason kidd shipped out…lol.
The NETS are coming!
WHO CARES?
really, who cares if someone talked negatively about the Nets?
Is a sea change from they talked POSITIVELY about the Nets? And when was that?
like a shot over the bow
i liked it and still do. anyone who doesn’t like it doesn’t understand it. Because he/she is looking for a quick fix and doesn’t realize that this is just a small part of the long term plan.
Agreed, it’s not about the Nets letting the Knicks know that they are here. Who cares what Knicks think? It was to make the rest of the world take notice.
Come on
Who cares?
Our owner said he was going to steal Knick fans and where was the location of the billboard?
The world did notice they weren’t impress.
Forget the hype. I rather let the world take notice about what we do on the court and not a billboard.
by killa kadafi191 on Jul 30, 2010 11:01 AM EDT reply actions
lol
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Terrible move by pulling it down
Maybe because I work in advertising, but how are you going to give an ad campaign a 1-month flight with only one placement. Terrible.
Let the damn thing sit up there all season long. Show it as a sign that the Blueprint is still in place. We’re still dedicated to greatness. And it will be a great reminder of that when we have a better record than the Knicks at season’s end.
Keep it up, commit to your message, and show some cojones.
I agree
and it did take cojones to do that in the first place
now though, lets let our actions on the court and through the front office do the talking.
These fools can only pretend to not smell a burning fire for only so long before they get engufled themselves.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions
And let's hope
that this now-you-see it, now-you-don’t way of doing business isn’t symptomatic of how the new owner operates.
I also agree.
They should have kept it up there until at least the end of the summer. In fact, I feel like this can be interpreted as a sign of defeat by those without knowledge of the lease, when in reality it was just the lease expiring. This easily comes off as the Nets failing in free agency and throwing in the towel with their marketing because of it.
"We aim above the mark to hit the mark." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson
"We're looking at hiring the Red Army choir to perform at half-time along with Russia's top dancing bear collective." -Mikhail Prokhorov
"Don't worry about my cap" - Lou Lamoriello
a sign of defeat
….would have been to act like desperate fools and signing David Lee to a max deal to appease folks with little knowledge of how to build a basketball team and to give off the appearance of doing something.
Taking down an ad? Pfft. Small potatoes.
We went to the bathroom on their lawn. Nevermind not landing Lebron. That was just a declaration of war, and it’s a war that I am confident that we will win when the dust settles in 5 years.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
I like where your head is at
-Say man when I was growing up we wanted a Jacuzzi, we had to fart in the tub.
i'm in a good mood, so i'll let this one slide.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions
good point I wasn't thinking about that
IDK thats kind of a good point if it was for marketing why take it down. It looks like running home with our tail between your legs cause you missed your primary objective. Even if this was not what your were doing it sure as heck can be misconstrued as such. So if for nothing else it should be left up for appearences. If they left it up until the season started they I could understand the marketing aspect of it more then I do now.
Since the face been revealed the game got real
by BL3ACH on Jul 30, 2010 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
not running with tail between their legs
They put the billboard up with point of getting their message across. They got their message out there, no point in keeping it up there.
The billboard was intended to shock. It actually loses that part of it’s value if it’s kept up there.
Disagree.
It was just a suttle (or not so suttle) message from the Nets, mainly Proky, that they’re under new management now and the Knicks’ spot on top of the New York market is not secure. I think the billboard did it’s job (I mean, Dolan called the NBA offices because he didn’t like the sign) and to keep it up there longer wouldn’t have served any benefit.
Now let Yormarket get on putting up “It’s All New” billboards around the city so that Knick fans can look up and laugh, but this time keep the billboards there throughout the season because those same people won’t be laughing in March.
by NBRITM on Jul 30, 2010 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
subtle*
"We aim above the mark to hit the mark." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson
"We're looking at hiring the Red Army choir to perform at half-time along with Russia's top dancing bear collective." -Mikhail Prokhorov
"Don't worry about my cap" - Lou Lamoriello
THIS
rec’s in effex
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Ahem... WHITEwash?!?!
First “guru” and now this, I’m offended…
Just kidding, happy Friday, Netsland!
The billboard did what it was supposed to do… Anger the Knicks FO and promote the team. Just cuz LeQueen played everyone for fools, doesn’t mean it wasn’t a good idea. Bold, but still a good idea.
by JohnFromLongIsland on Jul 30, 2010 11:05 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
I just think we should be more focused on
Winning and less focused on getting in a peeing contest with the Knicks. I think now the Nets are not playing in the swamp anymore they can focus on building the fan base. Wins are the real way to slight the Knicks not cute little marketing games. It makes the Nets front office look small when they are involved in petty of the court antics like this imo.
That aside I am excited about most of the moves and can’t wait for the season to start. We will be in a better position in three years as a franchise. If there was a direct market in NY that could attempt to rival Manhattan, it would hands down be Brooklyn. I just think the Nets have a real opportunity here with new ownership to shine a different light on the team. I hope they hit the ground running.
Since the face been revealed the game got real
If you think the Nets first goal was to do anything other then aggravate the Knicks
then I don’t know what to tell you.
Since the face been revealed the game got real
If you think the Nets first goal was to do anything other then aggravate the Knicks
then I don’t know what to tell you.
Since the face been revealed the game got real
Or to just slap the knicks in the face, i mean come on this is a NY state of mind
Have to be bigger and better than the competition. This sign was a bold marketing campaign, and is flaunting one of our biggest acquisitions this summer in Proky
So why take it down if its for appearences like you said when now it looks like you missed your goal?. If what your are saying is true about bold marketing taking it down now looks so much worse then if they left it up for a while longer. imo
Since the face been revealed the game got real
thats business also, do you people really think leaving it up there would make much a difference
you would just say he is wasting more money. It was the boldness of throwing that sign up there and getting the nets the faces in NYC for a little. Mind you the nets are still in jersey, they are just getting their feet wet in nyc
I could care less if he is wasting money. When this first went up my opinion was this better work what ever he is trying to pull off. I like most of the moves he made. But when the media is saying the Nets didn’t sign who they wanted and struck out, then they take this down it sends the wrong message like they missed their goal. But that is just my opinion right or wrong.
Since the face been revealed the game got real
all i have to say is the nets have some pretty good numbers in ticket sales already
so you do the math
Completely agree.
If you want to take it down, you replace it with another one, with a different message to everyone, pointing to the future (probably without Jay-Z who will never be heard from again, now that he been made to look like a non-Plaaya by Lebron). THEN you take it down.
Its pure tail-between-the-legs impression.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
the sky is falling
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Under NO CIRCUMSTANCES are Net fans to criticize their team. That is not what being a fan is. Fans are supposed to CHEER. By definition all team moves are GREAT. ALL our players are GREAT or are going to be great if we give them enough time. And last year was GREAT (except for all the people involved who we have gotten rid of – who were GREAT when they were here, but are no longer.
GO NETS!
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 30, 2010 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
That's not the point
I feel luck much of the criticism comes from increased expectations. The billboard, the moxie, and the LeBron sweepstakes are all a part of that euphoria. From that standpoint the billboard was successful. I, personally, don’t think that taking it down means that expectations have been lowered, I just think it’s run its course. I think people have a right to criticize, they just need to be fair. We are much better off now than we were before Prokhorov and other than the unlikely scenario that we won the lottery or the free agent extravaganza this process was likely to take time. The goal remains the same and the foundation of the blueprint remains intact.
I don’t think many understand the undertaking of changing the also-ran Nets into the Brooklyn/New York Nets. The whole front office, coaching staff, and roster needed major transformations. If you try to do that in a year you will most likely make mistakes. I think some of the decisions are curious, but I like the majority of them. We only can wait to see the product on the court.
That was MrDollarBills point. Perhaps not yours, his. He is very consistent on this. No criticism of teams acts or its hallowed players.
As far as taking it down or not, I was speaking exclusively in terms of advertising, what have been the intelligent thing to do, given the rise of expectations that it generated.
And, if people don’t understand the transformation, its the Nets job to explain it, to communicate it to their fans. If they don’t understand this vital thing, then that is one more thing the Nets have done a poor job on.
Personally, my expectations were never raised very high. This was a 12 win team last year, something everyone wants to forget.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 30, 2010 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions
you're being extreme
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m being a Net FAN!!!
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 30, 2010 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
The sky may be falling...
I know the crazy positive fans on here drive you nuts KV, but I feel the same way about the 100% negative fans. I saw 240 comments on here and though “Isaac is here”, but we have enough pessimism on here without him these days. All before we have played a game!! Proky’s team hasn’t played a game, Derrick and James haven’t played a game, non of our new free agents have played a game for us yet. Why shouldn’t we be positive now?? We could be alright, we could suck. I am hoping we are good. It’s better for my health!!
The SUPER positive fans do drive me crazy. But the answer to the negative fans (unreasonably negative fans) is not to be super positive. Its to be sober and thinking hard on what will likely make the team better.
There is for instance the stance:
1. Favors IS going to be a bust.
2. Favors COULD be a bust.
3. Favors IS going to be a monster, a man-beast.
The benefit of taking number 2 is that it requires things like really hoping that the Nets get a hold of a PF who can really hold the fort down for 2 years so that Favors’ isn’t thrust into the lineup prematurely, so he doesn’t experience things that make him lose confidence, etc, etc, etc. It requires that we find a really sweet passing PG who can set Favors up for easy baskets, so that he won’t have to work for his shot right away, and his confidence will grow.
Position number 3 is not only as worthless as position number 1, it also has the unreasonably expectation that Favors is going to burst onto the scene and dominate by year’s end. It feed into the kinds of expectations which will make media coverage pretty harsh if Favors falls in hard times in the first years. It leads to the kinds of thoughts that actually might HELP Favors become a bust.
And that is just the example of Favors.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 30, 2010 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions
So what?
if you think he’s going to be a great player.
first of all, that is not a “FAN” position, that is the official, publicly stated position of the franchise.
you do understand the difference?
Nets fans seem to think there will be a test on all of this.
It’s a basketball team. What good is it to root for a team and diss it before it has played a single game.at the same time?
We are on the same page, I know how it looks. Do you think its possible Stern got involved with this? Told Pro he didn’t like it because Dolan complained?
Since the face been revealed the game got real
Stern probably laughed
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I think someone in the Nets thought the ad looked pretty silly considering the Jay-Z factor. In fact Jay-Z himself, who was reportedly embarrassed by Lebron freezing him out, might even have wanted it to come down.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 30, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions
we are focused on winning
that’s why we’re taking our time and rebuilding properly, and not making desperate moves.
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah time to move on agreed. From today we can focus on the season. I can’t wait.
Since the face been revealed the game got real
aye!
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions
all of you are just mad, either mad net fans that think we should have signed Lebron and cant get over it, or an idiotic angry knick fan who thinks their team is going in a certain direction. This is just getting the foot in the door, showing the nets are no longer worried of the knicks, this is the future tri state dynasty. It is a blueprint and the nets are shaping it to form, doesnt happen over night. To be honest with you this add was probably prokys pocket change, and fun, just imagine what is to come. You blame this guy for not being able to do things he cant control like signing Lebron. Again, at least we didnt get stuck with some over paid cap anchor just to make some splash, This is a professional organization now. Welcome to the new era nets
by Benl1 on Jul 30, 2010 11:38 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Prokhorov has probably...
…blown more money on a night with “escorts” while out with his buddies than he did to pay for that ad.
Pfft!
Dolan flies in a rented G4, Prokhy flies in his G5
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah, it takes a big visionary to blow money on escorts
Proky may be a big deal in Russia (actually, he is not. his fate is subject to the whim of Putin) partying with paid escorts.
But Proky has yet to show that he is a capable, shrewd man who can out compete and outmaneuver in a cleanly, regulated playground that is the NBA.
Only when Proky has managed to produce a winning NBA product (where there’s a level playing field) will I respect his abilities.
Unlike MrDollarBills here, I am not easily impressed by a glorified Russian mobster who owes his existence to the good nature of Vlad Putin.
I but Proky will have a giant remake and hang it up in the giant living room of his yacht.
Yes, the living room in his yacht.
Consequences will never be the same.
*bet*
Consequences will never be the same.
by NetsMets4Life on Jul 30, 2010 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
sounds bout right
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
I LOVED the BILLBOARD!!!
No Where on that Billboard does it say LEBRON.
Nets Placing Ad – Expensive
No Lebron or Wade – Disappointing
Knicks Management Upset about Ad – PRICELESS
lol @ Dolan trying to call Jay Z
“What’s the difference between Dolan and Mikhail Prokhorov?”
“About 15-17 billion dollars …..sucker, beat it”
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
But Proky is starting to look like a windbag
after the lack of a big-name FA signing and now taking down his smarty-pants billboard, which was probably Yormark’s idea in the first place. But 99% of what we’ve been reading and hearing from the media is hot air anyway, since all that counts is how well the “all new” Nets compete on the court in the upcoming season.
i hope they replace it
with an audio billboard of the 1-877-kars-4kids commercial
Ever see a guy say "goodbye" to a shoe before?!
i want to kill someone when i hear that commercial
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions
they can't even spell
K A R S Kars for Kids lol
-Say man when I was growing up we wanted a Jacuzzi, we had to fart in the tub.
Doesn't matter
How much he spent on the ad or that we didn’t land a big free agent, the billboard dud what had to do, create more buzz about the nets that there has been in recent years, for better or worse, people are paying attention
by Dfence on Jul 30, 2010 3:14 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
People WERE paying attention
Right now we have 3 months til tip off with nothing really overwhelmingly awesome going on.
Come week 1 of the NFL, do you think anyone will care about the Nets current situation?
It should have went up in September if it’s original purpose had nothing to do with LeBron and was just to “create a buzz”.
The fact that it went up when it did and we didn’t get LeBron makes us look kinda foolish to the non NetsDaily community. And don’t give me that any news is good news ish.
ugh…NFL…hurry the F up
Ever see a guy say "goodbye" to a shoe before?!
Hmmmmmm
Patience my friend, the season has yet to start and you’re giving up. We have a young team who no one expects to do anything, which should be give them a chip on there shoulders. Harris is reunited with the " little man with the big plan", plus we have to great. Rookies, James IMO will be in the race for Roy. I like how everything ended up give the fact that we didn’t sign a big free agent, gives the youngsters a chance to define themselves because right now, almost anyone could end up starting, they should be hungry
by Dfence on Jul 30, 2010 3:32 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Just stop trying to label them as a NY team
The Nets haven’t been a NY team since their second season in the NBA when they left for NJ. It’s not like the Devils market themselves as a NY team. This can sometimes alienate the existing fans as if they are not important. I can still remember when I saw an ad for the Nets by the PABT over in Times Sq, but it was by the Lincoln Tunnel and there are buses that can be taken to Nets games. Overall, the more they try to be a NY team, the more they will be in the shadow of the Knicks, and that’s even if they do move to Brooklyn. The Knicks have been around longer, and they will always be looked as the top team in the city when it comes to the NBA. Just market them as a NJ team instead, because that’s where the team is now and where their fan base is. Proky could do a better job by placing a mural of himself in Newark.
What do you mean even if?
THEY ARE MOVING TO BROOKLYN
-Say man when I was growing up we wanted a Jacuzzi, we had to fart in the tub.
THE BARCLAYS CENTER HAS TO BE... AT LEAST 3 TIMES BIGGER THAN THIS
Consequences will never be the same.
by NetsMets4Life on Jul 30, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Why I said that
The more the Nets try to market themselves as a NY team, the more they will be overshadowed by the Knicks. It’s not like the Knicks put some ad in NJ to promote themselves when they already have the boroughs to do that. It’s not that I am saying that there are no Nets fans outside of NJ, because I happen to be one of them, and I live up in Pleasantville, which is in the middle of Westchester County. However, that number is not as big as those who actually do live closer to their team. Please remember that the reason the Nets left for NJ was because they felt overshadowed by the Knicks when they played their first season as an NBA franchise. On a sidenote, cut with the pictures, because I find that very childish looking at them from an intellectual standpoint, plus it shows how much you guys try to dodge the actual points by thinking that a blanket statement can just answer it all.
by Tal Barzilai on Jul 31, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I posted that picture becasue you said
“Overall, the more they try to be a NY team, the more they will be in the shadow of the Knicks, and that’s even if they do move to Brooklyn.”
They are moving to Brooklyn – and yes, I feel like I am taking crazy pills
-Say man when I was growing up we wanted a Jacuzzi, we had to fart in the tub.
Blah blah blah
It funny how ny fans don’t say the same about the jets and the giants even though they play in jersey in fact the only true ny football team is the bills. Anyway would love to see the nets stay in Newark but it’s not gonna happen, they should have made that move as soon as the rock was opened.
by Dfence on Jul 30, 2010 3:48 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
smh
I know but what’s the fun in that?? lol
Sorry you guys have to deal wit this Bills guy frequently
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
by semsemma on Jul 30, 2010 4:08 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
another fan
thank you for your support, lol
"No one stands on the top of the world. Not you, not me, not even gods. But the unbearable vacancy of the throne in the sky is over. From now on...I will be sitting on it."
by MrDollarBills on Jul 30, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
I Know
I mean he almost has Terrence Williams like per 36 numbers!
Twill: 13.4, 7.1, 4.6
Graham: 13.3, 6.3, 1.2
Just got to get those assists up, and you’re a triple double MACHINE! This guy is sick!
:)
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 30, 2010 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Your right
We should tell management to trade T-will for Joey Graham, ask Durant feature graham with his sneakers lets see how well that turns out lol
Yeah, like being asked to wear Durant’s sneakers is a sign of being a great basketball player. “Guys like” Nate Robinson, now that is an allstar in the making. The point is, if you are going to make fun of Joey Graham (for no apparent reason), realize that his stats are not that far from someone you hold dear.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 30, 2010 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions
If Joey Graham and T-will were free agents
You think teams would actually look at Joey Graham as an option over T-will. I’ve never heard another teams announcers praise him Mr Graham, or any other NBA player give him props or watch him get triple doubles or take over a game, yeah you can look at T-will’s rookie year stats on a team with no coach or direction and compare him to JOEY GRAHAM but I mean honestly to me its ridiculous.
The point is that in performance they are in the same comparable range. Taking over games on the WORST TEAM IN BASKETBALL is no hallowed mark. It is VERY Nate Robinsonesque.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
TWill was a beast during the last 2 months of the season, and that made the team better: they won 5 of their final 12 games- w/ TWill averaging 15, 7 and 6 over that stretch. That’s almost as many games as they had won over the previous 70 games (when we collected a 7-63 record). Nets got HALF their wins (6) in March and April, which is when TWill broke out, averaging 14.1 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 4.9 apg and .370 from 3 pt territory in March, and 14.3 ppg, 7.1 rpg and 6.3 apg in April. He averaged 14.1 ppg, 6.8 rpg and 5.4 apg over the final 2 months (22 games, which is more than one quarter of the season, which is a significant enough amount of games). He became the first Nets rookie to get a triple-double in TEN years since KMart. He was awarded the Rookie of the Month award in April. Obviously, that holds no importance in your opinion. But Cousins getting the ROTM award for playing well in the SL does. Ouch. We weren’t a good bball team last year (you have to take into account other reasons why that happened), but there is evidence that once TWill broke out, he made our team more competitive. Obviously, Joey Graham would have done the same. All he would need to do is learn how to create for others and become a special passer, which is an insignificant thing to accomplish from what I can infer from the post in which you compare them.
Almost cried reading this post
Great post. But to think KV the guy who makes a big deal of bloggers ages brings up stats per (isnt stats like a young thing?). Anywho, Nate robinson takes over games with his scoring he does not fill up the stat sheet, Ben Gordon takes over a game with scoring, shoot many people take over games with scoring but not many fill up the stat sheet and get other people involved. Also him being the best player on the worst teams really means nothing, this is your whole argument every day but it makes no sense because he was not playing against the Nets he was still playing against the rest of the league i dont think the comp gets worst as we get worst.
The only people who think Twill is even a “good” player are Net fans. He will get very little playing time (no room) on a team which was the worst team in the league last year. That he cannot even START on the worst team in the league from a year ago should tell you that Net fans, at least some of them, are delusional.
Hey I can’t START on a team that won 12 games last year, but I’m going to be a star in this league.
Yeah.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Shaun Livingston was a BEAST in the last months of Washinston's year
And he was blip on the FA radar screen.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
no, he wasn't
the only month during which he averaged doublde digit scoring numbers was April. His best stretch of the season was an 8 game one (April: 15.5 ppg and 6.4 apg). Not to mention he has a serious history of injuries and 5 year experience, he is what he is. That’s why he was “blip” on the FA radar.
The major players on the team that played with him increased their performance substantially. He was a beast facilitator, which is what a PG is.
Shaun Livingston’s end of the season statistics were pretty damn impressive, to be sure. In 26 games with the Wizards, Livingston averaged 13 points and 6.2 assists/36 minutes while posting a 14.4 PER and a 58.2% true shooting percentage. Those are really great numbers who uses as few possessions as Shaun does. But even I realize that it’s hard to imagine Livingston shooting that well again. Shooting percentages are a bit flukey, and Livingston’s shooting was so out of line with what he was doing even when healthy.
But there’s no denying this fact: Livingston’s presence made many of the other players on the team better. In particular, our three young players that have been sharply criticized over the years: Andray Blatche, Nick Young and JaVale McGee. For most of the year, those three were drifting, not showing the kind of improvement we all hoped to see. Blatche certainly started off well, and showed more than he had in previous seasons, but he also saw his production take a hit and his attitude suffer a bit. McGee was buried on the bench, while Young went in and out of the rotation. But by the end of the year, all three looked a lot better than they did at the beginning of the season, and while there are many reasons for that (playing time, individual development, etc), Livingston deserves a lot of credit for setting a good example with his work ethic and for getting them the ball in the right spots.
To illustrate this, check out those three players’ numbers with and without Livingston on the team. (Note: I’m using the 25-game mark instead of the 26-game mark because that coincides directly with October-February vs. March-April. Also, Livingston barely played in his first game, so I think it’s ok).
Andray Blatche before Shaun joined the team: 11.1 points, 5.8 rebounds, 1.4 assists on 49.4% shooting in just under 24 minutes per game.
Andray Blatche after Shaun joined the team: 20.8 points, 7.3 rebounds, 3.6 assists on 46.1% shooting in 36.5 minutes per game.
Nick Young before Shaun joined the team: 7.2 points, 1.4 rebounds, 0.7 assists on 40% shooting and 42% shooting from three-point range in 16.9 minutes per game.
Nick Young after Shaun joined the team: 11.4 points, 1.3 rebounds, 0.6 assists on 44.2% shooting and 38.4% from three in 23.7 minutes per game.
JaVale McGee before Shaun joined the team: 3.8 points, 2.1 rebounds on 51% shooting in 11 minutes per game.
JaVale McGee after Shaun joined the team: 10.1 points, 6.7 rebounds on 51% shooting in 23.4 minutes per game.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Yikes Andres is giving you a whooping today
KV you do know T-Will is only going into his second year dont you? I also might have to add that Manu has been coming off the bench alot in his years and Odom is coming off the bench ( even behind Ariza he was coming off the bench) so not starting (in your 2nd year of play) is just a dumb argument your sounding like a youngster 2day. “he doesnt start and what about his stats per”
Yeah, Twill is the next Manu, (to go along with Magic and Lebron). I get it Manu is a sxith man, so EVERY guy who doesn’t start is really an Allstar player.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions
KV
No offense but it sounds like you just personally hate T-Will I mean your talking about a kid who was a rookie last year, nobody is saying he is the next magic Johnson or Lebron. To say ohh he was the best player o the worst team in the league makes no sense, we were still playing NBA teams who were playing for something and did not want to get beat by us, he performed more than well towards the end of the season, was recognized with the rookie of the month.
I actually like Twill. I hate him for this team. Just as I would hate Nate for this team.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah
this “he is not one of this team’s five best player bc he may not start” argument makes no sense. There are players who are just better suited to come off the bench. Again, when TWill broke out HE WAS COMING OFF THE BENCH, yet he was the team best player during that stretch.
The team is a HORRIBLE team. They are not a championship team who has the luxury of leaving their best players off the floor for effect. Wait till you see how few minutes he plays this year.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
again
TWill made the team more competitive (even if they weren’t very good). There’s evidence for this, you just don’t seem willing to address it:
TWill was a beast during the last 2 months of the season, and that made the team better: they won 5 of their final 12 games- w/ TWill averaging 15, 7 and 6 over that stretch. That’s almost as many games as they had won over the previous 70 games (when we collected a 7-63 record). Nets got HALF their wins (6) in March and April, which is when TWill broke out, averaging 14.1 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 4.9 apg and .370 from 3 pt territory in March, and 14.3 ppg, 7.1 rpg and 6.3 apg in April. He averaged 14.1 ppg, 6.8 rpg and 5.4 apg over the final 2 months (22 games, which is more than one quarter of the season, which is a significant enough amount of games).
And he is the 3rd string SG. Hello?
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions
T-Will is not better than CLee?
CLee played better on a championship team did he not? and on the worst team in the league he didnt even outperform the horrible T-Will.. Ok case closed KV nice chatting with u
He is the 3rd strong SG.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions
The TEAM brought in Morrow. I didn’t. The obviously thought they had a need a SG. Hello?
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Face the facts.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
SIGH
This can’t get any more ridiculous. stats per 36 minutes? Is this a joke? And how are those assists numbers any similar? “Just got them up and he’s a TD machine”? He averages 1.2 assist per 36 minutes, for god’s sake! TWill’s passing skills are outstanding for a wing player, and that’s what makes him special Saying that all a dime a dozen role player needs to do in order to be as good as TWill is to get his assist numbers up is hilarious, bc that’s a hard thing to accomplish, and that’s what makes TWill a rare player. Do you realize how stupid that comparison sounds?
Do you realize how stupid that comparison sounds?
A tad less stupid than comparisons made to Lebron and Magic Johnson and HoF which are regularly made on this forum.
Between Magic Johnson and Graham, Twill is infinitely closer to Graham. He will not even be starting for this team.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions
People say his game is similar
You can’t compare him to Steve Kerr, because he’s not a spot up shooter, I mean he passes, rebounds and scores things those guys did, Nobody is on their level right now.
Crazy. He is the 3rd String SG on the worst team in basketball from last year..
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
The coach says hes not the PG, and his not the SF. The coach was clearly involved in the decision to bring in Morrow (Hello?).
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Atronic, KV does this every other day
He makes it seem like people are saying something they are not to better his argument.
Every time someone posts something insane, especially in regard to Twill’s incredible potential.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
He has been called a “mini-Lebron” and more recentlly a “mini-Magic”. He has also been called a player of HoF potential.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
More per 36 stats comparisons!
Kris Humphries: 14.1 pts, 11.2 rebs
Al Horford: 14.5 pts, 10.1 rebs
I guess Hump is right there with an All-Star big man like Horford, riiiiiiiiiiiiiight???
If someone on an Atlanta forum decided to ridicule Humphries for no apparent reason, I would bring up his per 36 numbers and the comparison as a sign that he is probably better than the Hawk fan thought.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions
A ballsy move - love it
Who cares what it cost him; i think it’s the first salvo in many that he’s going to do all over the city; probably in two yrs he’ll rent out the top of the Empire State Bldg so it can have Nets logo; and perhaps Proky’s face will be on the ball when it drops on New Yrs Eve or how about a Nets float in the Macy’s Day Parade. I love how brash he is – how little he cares what other people think; he’s creating some buzz cuz here to put the Nets on the map and I think he’s going to succeed. And if he up and sells the team tomorrow, we won’t be any worse off than we’ve been the past 6 yrs.
a lot of companies take out ads when there is a change of ownership
this is just a big one.
by Net Income on Jul 30, 2010 6:08 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
see the nets however you want to, mediocre now, yes, but the whole persona is to improve into a championship team, unfortunately we didnt rig free agency to get three big names together, ooo well. What we are doing is building from within getting coaches to work on our players game. This has been a big improvement from last season, and lots of room to work with. Also this free agency, minus JJ LBJ and DWade were a whole bunch of PF, and the nets just drafted Favors who they feel has tons of potential, they didnt want to clog his playing time, and commit to a more expensive pf. The only signing i dont get was T outlaw who could have been got probably 2 mill cheaper. Other than that they went out. grabbed the best shooter in the nba at a great price, drafted defense, and found a back up to Devin Harris. Also hopefully Outlaw fills the need for a scoring SF that we lacked last year. These nets are all young and developing, and most may surprise this year with their game. That is why i keep a positive outlook, because my team is improving and are continuing to improve, and if people wouldnt be so quick to be judgemental they would realize there are not many things the nets missed out on in which they could control, and the things they did do, like signing an arsenal of coaches and most likely improving training facilities. You have to believe this is just the beginning to turning this team into a winning franchise
I don't care what Knick fans say
They are going to definitely miss Al Harrington, because as defensively garbaj as they are there going to need all the offense they can get honestly he scared me the most when we played the Knicks.
Harrington scared me, because our coach was using Yi to defend him. Now someone like Outlaw would be available to defend Harrington.
Harrington predicted Knicks would have about the same number of wins (29) this year and I would agree with him – I predict 30 wins.
Hopefully the Knicks will freeze their roster, with the false hope of getting Melo next summer (I expect Melo to re-sign before Denver withdraws their generous extension offer). Nuggets have the power to trade Melo to another team who gives the best offer, in order to pressure Melo to re-sign. Besides, Knicks won’t be able to pay Melo a large salary unless they dismantle their team once again.
Amare may be wearing his Clark Kent glasses a lot this season, sitting in street clothes on the bench.
Besides, watching reruns on NBATV of Phoenix in the playoffs, convinced me of how many easy baskets Amare had, solely due to Nash’s passing.
NO
are you kidding. we will not miss al harrington one bit. yes, i loved al’s enthusiasm for the game an he as an extremley hard worker but his style of play is not conducive to winning basketball games. al needs to learn how to pass the ball. the knicks will be young, exciting, and fun to watch. i think we will make the playoffs asa 7 or 8 seed honestly. anthony randolph is going to flourish here. that trade was phenomenal. donnie walsh got more value for david lee than the cavaliers got for lebron james. enough said.
Again i agree with you
Knicks got rid of Nate the great and Al Harrington IMO both players that do not play winning basketball unless on a very good team.
But i think you are putting to much on Randolph. I dont think the Knick fans are going to be patient with him, and its sad because he is not ready to be that guy yet he has TONS of flaws in his game and is very young, But you guys speak like he is going to be a unstoppable force this year. He needs work on his jumpshot, cant handle the ball in traffic (that right there would cause him to struggle at the SF spot. PF is for Amare’. I guess he could play at the center position but i dont think he is capable of being a star quality player there.
anthony
randolph has hall of fame skills. don nelson is a moron obivousally and gs was not a good fit for him. if you read any warriors blog they are crying over this deal. in response to his jumpshot……
I’m ready. I told Dan this morning after workouts I wished the season started tomorrow. I’m ready to play. I’m ready to get out there. I feel I’ve added some things in my game. I feel like my shot is a thousand times better. I’m just ready to get out there and show everybody all the hard work I’ve put in since April 15, since the last game of the season.
it will be interesting to see where d’antoni plays randolph since he is so versatile.
Yeah but you guys don't play any defense
Your team is innately flawed and will win noting, why you might as well just keep guys like Harrington and out score people.
i
agree that the knicks should hire someone who is a defensive specialist, but to say that this NEW knicks team will play no defense is wrong. this is practically a totally different team and the remaining guys actually play defense. lee, harrington, duhon, nate did NOT play defense. devin harris, anthony morrow, jordan farmar, brook lopez, are NOT good defenders btw.
Devin harris and farmar can easily be good defenders
but Knicks simply have no scheme and if you are running and gunnin all day and jacking up 3’s its hard to play D and its hard to win championships like that
i
agree with some of that. i think it is hard to win champsionships with this style of play which is why i am not the highest on mike, although i like him bc he is an offensive mastermind. defense wins games in the playoffs i agree. i think the knicks should hire a defensive specialist and i think mike should get a year with a real team before he’s judged.
harris is too damn fragile and weak to be that good of a defender. bigger guards destroy him.
Its more about team defense then individual D
harris like avery said can be a top defender. But with out good team defense that means nothing. I think you have to get rid of Mike D to win a championship, because regardless of what defensive minded assistant you put out there if you are playing that kind of offense its almost impossible to be that good on defense. But if you get rid of Mike D then the Amare signing is considered a failure because thats the kind of system he plays in. So IMO Knicks can get better, they can get alot better they can even become like the Suns in the future and win 50 games a year if they add pieces but if you got mike thats as far as your going to go and right now the knicks are commited to mike D because they just gave a fat paycheck to stat
what
else is avery supposed to say… of course he is going to say that. again, when you are as weak as harris is it is difficult to be an excellent defender. again, im not that high on mike. i think the offense is fine…. the suns played almost the exact same way and almost beat the lakers. the only difference is gentry tweaked the system and the team played more defense, hence why i think a defensive specialist would suffice. the paycheck means nothing…. if it did larry brown would have stayed. money is endless for dolan. walsh believes d’antoni clearly as do i. ill give him this year if we do not make the playoffs ill be calling for van gundy.
That's exactly the knicks problem
" money is not issue " man there’s a cap, if u fire mike D u have to find someone like him or revamp the roster because that roster was put together for that system. Nuffield said
Thats the biggest problem
I think your team will face, I think you guys need to fire Antoni or hire a legit defensive assistant, I think that will be what can actually turn things around because the free flowing offense can only get you so far in my opinion. Lee,T-will,D-James,Favors,Brook,Harris and even Farmar are good defenders, Harris I think will commit more this year but it starts with the coach and the mentality.
The Knicks will be in the playoffs.....
You guy’s talk alot of crap……..After carefully evaluating the Knicks current situation ,the players they lost,the players they added and the fact that D’Antoni is their coach I feel that the Knicks will definitely be the 8th seed in this years playoffs……..It’s really going to be fun when the Net’s sweep them in the 1st Round………
the
nets are not making the playoffs. imo detriot, indiana and possibly clevland are the only teams worse than you. if devin can stay healthy and favors develops very quickly then i change my mind. but with really no nba ready starting 4 to compliment brook its going to be challenging to win many ball games. i think if the nets spent the money on lee or boozer they would be a 7 or 8 seed but throwing all that money at role players isnt going to help them make the playoffs imo. but thats why they play the games. the nets do have alot of picks and cap room, so they could land a good player/star at the deadline if their in the race, which they should be.
I Dont disagree
at all… So do you think we have a better future lined up then the knicks?
no
i think the knicks have a better future imo. i believe in anthony randolph and danillo gallinari first of all. second, i think the amare signing was huge, not only bc he amare is a 5 time all star, etc. but bc he is friends with melo, etc…. we all saw this offseason how much friendship comes into play. so yes, i think carmelo anthony will be a nyk. if not, why not just sign the contract already? also, i think ray felton is going to have a monster year. he is such a gifter ball handler and i think eh will excel in a fast paced offense. i also think ronny turiaf provides some veteran leadership, which can’t hurt. when the team’s so young. i like d’antoni, but i do not love him. i wish they would hire a defensive specialist.
i think the nets have a nice future too. obviousally with brook at the 5 that is a great start. harris is an all star obviousally, so if he stays healthy he wll be a big boost for them. i like williams a lot as well morrow. i think avery is a phenomenal coach. i dont like king though and im not high on favors…. i personally feel like he will be a bust, but we shall see. i also do not like any of the moves the nets made this offseason with the exception of signing morrow…. great deal imo. i definitley think the nets can make the playoffs if harris stays healthy and favors develops quickly.
Cant say I disagree either
But what about Toronto. I cant possibly see how we could end up being worse then them. And possibly Washington, but that depends on John Wall imo. Le’s see if he comes into the league with a big bang.
Consequences will never be the same.
by NetsMets4Life on Jul 31, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
totally
forgot about toronto. you guys are definitely better than the raptors. i think washington will fight for the 8th seed bc i think john wall will have a big year right out of the gate but if not then you guys will be better than them too. it wll be very interesting to see wall and arenas play 2together to say the least.
I think wall can DEf. play with gilbert
wall is pass first and Arenas is a scoring first SG he is not a PG
The Knicks will suck for years
Let me know when they get a big man who can defend. I give Amare 20 games before he stops playing D or gets injured. If Randolph was any king of player G.S. would never have given him up. He’s a pipe dream. They were better off with Lee and Harrington and they sucked with them. Dolan and Walsh are clueless. Trading your lottery pick for cap space and drafting your boy Gallo over Lopez pretty much sums up Walsh’s ability. Spending money on Lee or Boozer would have made us better but basically would never make us a title contender. I’d rather wait for Favors to develop. Either he leads us to a title in a few years and in the meantime if he sucks this year we will end up with a good draft pick while keeping our flexability.
yes people forget
that to get to the place where they wanted…enough cap room for two superstars…they gave up their first round pick in 2012 and agreed to swap picks in 2011. Because they gave up their pick in 2012, that means they can’t trade their 2013 pick. Cant trade your own pick two years in a row. So if they wanted to make a deal for someone like Chris Paul, they wouldnt be able to package any first round pick earlier than the 2014 pick.
And yet, the crazy sports writers at Newsday and the Post think the off-season was a success.
LOL
what a homer.
the knicks got more for david lee than the cavs got for LEBRON JAMES. Anthony Randoph recently turner 21 and is absolute stud… even bill simmons loves this deal for the Knicks. Also, buike and turiaf are solid nba players. not to mention turiaf provides some much needed veteran leadership to a young team.
STAT was a phenomenal signing. For one, he is a five-time all star, All NBA player, etc.
Secondly, he is best friends with Anthony who imo will be a Knick next year.
we signed ray felton to only 2 years…. that was a steal. yet you guys give outlaw 5….absurd. ray felton is perfect for d’antoni’s system… he’s gonnna have a tremednous year for us.
By trading ONE PICK (swapping the other) we were able to sign and trade Lee for buike randolph turiaf. without the tmac jeffries hill trade etc… this cannot happen. anthony randolph has hall of fame skills, i am thrilled he is a knick.
i dont think chris paul will be a knick, but to say we dont have the assets is wrong imo.
As a non-Knicks fan, completely agree.
"...where they don't play with a shot clock." - C. Sager
by kv on Jul 31, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions
You Knicks fans can't include melo or CP
in your future. They are not signed
The difference between Nets and Knicks fans is encapsulated
Knicks fans think giving a 24 year old Russian seven footer a three year deal at $10 million is a smart investment.
Nets fans think giving a 24 year old French seven footer a three year deal at $10 million is dumb and overpaying.
by Net Income on Jul 31, 2010 5:33 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
net income
only one year is guranteed to mosgov….. hence, why IT IS A SMART INVESTMENT!
lol please get your facts straight before you hate on the KNICKS!!!!
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