Prokhorov's First Impression of NBA: It's a "Machine" Built on "Star" Model
by Net Income on Nov 10, 2010 4:44 PM EST
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PrintMikhail Prokhorov writes in his blog Wednesday about first impressions of the NBA. Two of those impressions stand out: the league is "a tremendous machine" very much unlike Russian basketball and there's "a new model in which top players agree between themselves where they can play", not the "owners, managers, agents or fans". Has Prokhorov embraced this "new model"...and is that behind the Nets' pursuit of Carmelo Anthony?
Here's the full translation provided by a representative of Onexim...
"I went to the first Nets games and learned a lot by going to straight to the source, as they say. My main conclusion is that the NBA is a tremendous machine. No detail is too small, everything runs like clockwork and everyone is very professional. And that machine has gained a lot of distance on our Russian basketball. We're now working on how we can introduce some of elements of the NBA into our student basketball program. We need to see results in a relatively quick period of time so as not to lose heart and faith that we can be close to that standard. What's also interesting is how globalization is affecting the NBA, too. I mean the way that two great players, LeBron James and Chris Bosh, joined the Miami Heat to form a Big Three with Dwyane Wade. We clearly see a new model in which the top players agree between themselves where they want to play, and understand full well that their individual statistics will be lower as a result. Almost no one likes this - not the owners, not the managers, not the agents or the fans, although it's not a violation of NBA rules. It will be interesting to see what the upshot of this trend will be."
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Proky is so much smarter than he lets on
People don’t understand that, he studies everyone he talks to and makes it seem as though he lost in translation doesn’t know whats going on but he is very aware and watching everything.
Secretariat was the only "tremendous machine"
But it sounds like he DOESN’T like the banding together of superstars.
Of course, if that is the trend, one has to think he’ll want to adopt it himself. Problem is, what other superstar is coming here with Melo?
Probably the same question Melo has.
Section 18, Row 7 at The Rock!
While Proky is a very smart and wealthy man, his basketball IQ seems awfully low for an NBA owner.
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
i appreciate Prokhorov's stance...
he seems very aware of the goings-on, despite being seemingly so far removed from the daily life of the NBA…
and i really like how he saw straight through the big three, saying,
We clearly see a new model in which the top players agree between themselves where they want to play, and understand full well that their individual statistics will be lower as a result. Almost no one likes this – not the owners, not the managers, not the agents or the fans, although it’s not a violation of NBA rule
he knows that “almost” no one likes this
he also knows it's the reality
which is what he saying here and what he said when he defended the big three in a letter to USA Today back in July.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/letters/2010-07-29-letters29_ST2_N.htm
its funny because i consider myself a relatively young fan of the NBA...
i only turned 25 in may, but i find myself wishing for a simpler time in the NBA… a simpler time when a superstar sneezing did not warrant a front page article or two hours of talk radio debate. what happened?
Have to go back to pre-internet!
We are in a nonstop news cycle… so unfortunately people need things to report on.
Section 18, Row 7 at The Rock!
He is right its about who you know
Why no matter what this Franchise is better off with Jay-Z as a part owner, because of his contacts, will I still believe benefit us, there are meetings and looks we would never get without him.
+100000
Jay-Z, despite owning minimal portions to the team, has played a tremendous role in terms of giving the Nets some respect and has created a monster ownership with himself and proky forming a dynamic duo. Theres no doubt..
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
well
I dunno how well that really works. Lebron played us instead of letting Jay know about his plans, and Melo pretty much dismissed us in the media while at the same time gushing over the idea of playing for the Bulls or Knicks.
Jay Z is probably a cool dude to hang out with at parties but it’s not like anyone is dying to play for us. The stigma on this franchise will take lasers and drills to remove.
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:00 PM EST up reply actions
I am not surprised
If you were LeBron would you go play for your friend or play for a 3 headed monster? If you were Carmelo, would you let a .3 percent owner make an affect of where you want to be? I’m saying for media attention and a little love from others out there, Jay-Z is a very beneficial asset
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
yeah
but i’m talking in terms of attracting talent, which is the most important piece of the puzzle.
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
well then i agree
most definately useless for attracting talent, but then again what minority owner is?
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
C'mon Bills
What other NBA team has such a full arsenal of introduction hype songs to come out to? I say we should do a different one every game. Show me what you got? Hard Knock Life? Can’t Knock The Hustle? Brooklyn’s Finest? DOA? lol
BRING AGENT ZERO To NEWARK/BROOKLYN!!! We Keep FAVORS/BROOK/DEVIN TOO! The JETS/NETS are coming!
He wants Carmelo and a star to build the foundation for Brooklyn, but at what cost? Our future in Favors and picks, our present in Devin, and our winning now?
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
agreed
I think he has “star” on his mind which doesn’t bode well for the pieces that we have right now. It seems he feels the star is what drives the league, to a certain extent its true, but its certainly not right to gut the team, just to land a guy who probably doesn’t even want to be here.
I am going to turn this team around 360 Degrees- Jason Kidd
And that is my issue
He doesn’t quite get what a healthy Devin Harris means this team. Or a spark off the bench and potential starter in Favors or what lottery picks can one day become. His bball IQ is appalling.
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
is there any actual proof of this?
I don’t see him saying anything that would lead to that assumption. I also think a healthy devin harris is a pipe dream. And that an average pg and Carmelo would do WAY WAY more than Harris. That being said I agree as far as Favors.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
You think King is doing this??
No way. Theres a knife and an arm around King’s throat. He’s just a puppet in this show
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
where did I say anything about King
and doing what? We have no proof anything is actually being done, or if it is being done what’s even being offered. I’m saying it makes no sense to jump to these huge conclusions about Prokhy’s basketball IQ.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
i guess i interupted it wrong then
my bad. Just hearing him talk though i assume his IQ is low. Is there proof no, but it’s something i can guess. Just my opinion
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
Harris has been alright so far this year
but I could give a damn. I’d send him packing if it brought Melo here to play with Favors and Lopez up front
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
Harris and...
my point exactly. It’s not getting done without Favors, now is it?
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
your point seemed to be that Harris was a vital piece of the team
more vital than Carmelo could be.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
Harris and Favors
are picks are more vital.
And that is my issue
He doesn’t quite get what a healthy Devin Harris means this team. Or a spark off the bench and potential starter in Favors or what lottery picks can one day become
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
I agree Favors is vital
Harris and picks are not.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
My point
exactly. but the deal won’t get done without Favors. He is vital and when a healthy Devo is on this team, he isn’t as vital as Carmelo, but he’s a big time focal point
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
yeah
the problem is, do you want to get a quick fix that probably won’t make us a legit contender in this current climate and end up back in this position within 2 seasons or so, or gut it out and build up to the point where we can contend for the course of a decade?
Like with Melo for instance, we’re going to need another star to come here
Chris Paul looks like he’s back to his old form. Trading for Melo and then trying to flip Harris/Williams on New Orleans is not going to fly.
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 4:57 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah I'm wondering if it would be
Better to go after a Kevin Martin Danny Granger type of talent, really we just need a consistent scorer at the wing position that can at lest hold his own on D and create their own shot, to make D’s think twice while Favors grows up and starts beasting and Lopez does his thing.
This is my line of thinking
Our perimeter scorer doesn’t have to be a hall of famer, just someone that can get the job done.
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
Gilbert Arenas.....
BRING AGENT ZERO To NEWARK/BROOKLYN!!! We Keep FAVORS/BROOK/DEVIN TOO! The JETS/NETS are coming!
3 years after this one...
So his money would essentially be the same as Melo’s with an extension. Even a bit cheaper possibly. But my thing is he wouldn’t cost as many assets. We would retain alot. And at least he wants out, washington wants him out, everyone knows it. Just about him showing that he can play alil Washington and Rockets in 20 minutes. I would you guys watch with me an see what he has left 3rd or 4th game back
BRING AGENT ZERO To NEWARK/BROOKLYN!!! We Keep FAVORS/BROOK/DEVIN TOO! The JETS/NETS are coming!
There's nothing wrong with wanting to get Melo
it’s the cost that he needs to consider.
We clearly see a new model in which the top players agree between themselves where they want to play, and understand full well that their individual statistics will be lower as a result. Almost no one likes this – not the owners, not the managers, not the agents or the fans, although it’s not a violation of NBA rule
Glad he addressed that. The backdoor collusion is an absolute disgrace to the sport.
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
meh, stern kind of deserves it
he started the whole thing in motion by basically promoting stars and offense above all else, now it’s coming back to bite him. Removing handchecking in itself drastically changed how teams could be built and what could win in the post season, never mind the obvious star rules when it comes to calling fouls and walks/
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
I think we should call the Miami 3some The BACKDOOR BUDDIES
BRING AGENT ZERO To NEWARK/BROOKLYN!!! We Keep FAVORS/BROOK/DEVIN TOO! The JETS/NETS are coming!
seem like he is starting to get it
.We have good young players but the stars want to join already establish players. As I said many times similar to KG we need to make one move before we even talk to melo. What star or all star can we get????
That’s what proky should ask himself
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 4:55 PM EST reply actions
that's the problem
we might have to let it marinate for a another season or two for Lopez/Favors/Williams to improve but by then we could be screwed
the pressure of Brooklyn is almost counterproductive here.
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:26 PM EST up reply actions
GILBERT ARENAS CLAP,CLAP....CLAP CLAP CLAP
BRING AGENT ZERO To NEWARK/BROOKLYN!!! We Keep FAVORS/BROOK/DEVIN TOO! The JETS/NETS are coming!
The man knows what he is talking about
The top players in the league are now going to find ways to play on the same team together. IMO taking the OKC way is not going to win you a championship as long as stars try to form a “Big Three”. It’s also kind of hard to find a player like Durant to build a franchise around. So trying to model that team isn’t successfully happening anytime soon. Maybe the new bargaining agreement will change things but for the next few years the only teams that are competing for championships are the Lakers, Heat, Celtics, Magic.
if this is how the NBA will operate going into the next 15 years
they might as well start contracting teams now because small market teams are screwed
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:27 PM EST up reply actions
In other news
the heat still haven’t won anything, and have a pretty massive obvious weak spot when it comes to post defense. So maybe before deciding this is the new model we should wait for it to actually work? It worked with KG/Allen and Pierce because they were able to retain most of their team and role playing pieces and because KG is a defensive monster. Where as the big 3 in Miami looks like they would have been better off leaving Bosh in Toronto and getting a less finesse big man. If the Heat can’t handle front court players like Paul Millsap and Emeka Okafur, are we even sure they’re going to be able to handle Howard, or Gasol/ Bynum in the post season?
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
so what youre saying is it worked in Boston
two visits to the Finals in three years and a championship qualfies as working.
The first move was trading for Allen in a salary dump. The second move was getting KG to agree to an extension. Sounds familiar to me.
I'm saying the Heat model and Boston's model are drastically different
And it makes zero sense to lump them both together to support an idea that the NBA is following a new model when you’re looking at two drastically different variations of the same idea. One model can’t have drastically different variables.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
oh PLEASE.
all you’re doing is trying to justify your argument against trading for Anthony.
They are not “drastically different” models. They are nearly identical..get three players who can be easily integrated: preferably two perimeter players and a big guy. Sacrifice what you have to in terms of young players, cap space, whatever to get it done…and hope one or more of your new players are willing to accept less money to accommodate things under the salary cap.
by Net Income on Nov 10, 2010 5:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
it's quite clear
the model has worked. those who don’t think so are fooling only themselves.
you take what opportunity is provided you. Boston and Miami did it.
absolutely
and thats why i can’t hate it.
garnett was my favorite player in the league, but when he went to Boston, i had trouble rooting for him. same with lebron.
for these franchises to capitalize on their situation, all we as “losers” can really do is wish that we had the same oppurtunity, or capitalized on them when we did
But um
If Lebron came to the Nets, would you have been having the same “rooting” issues?
Section 18, Row 7 at The Rock!
hahaha absolutely NOT
but i am also used to rooting for my favorite players as well as my favorite team, because usually one doesn’t affect the other. the nets stayed in this corner and lost, while my favorite players were carrying their respective teams to victories, or winning themselves MVPs and DPotY
im just saying that the intial jealously/slighted fan symptoms are what leads me to root against these guys now, but i would be ecstatic if they became nets… obviously, they didnt
Except Boston kept Rondo
which idk, seems like it was kind of important don’t you think, along with Allen and Perkins.
And do you think all big men are created equal? Do you really not see the difference between a big man like KG and one like Bosh? Or the difference between getting a shooter like Allen and having too driving stars like Lebron and D-wade and how they all fit differently in an offense? That’s kind of the point, Allen and KG could be easily integrated, Bosh/Wade/Lebron don’t fit together as easily, which is why they had to get Mike Miller. KG provided offense, rebounding and instant post defense, Bosh not so much, hence why they’ve had no answer so far for athletic big men, how in the world are they identical when such a huge part of the game is accounted for in one and not in the other? The only youth really sacrificed was Al Jefferson, and he was traded for a much more complete player at the same position, and the only youth really sacrificed by the Heat was Beasley who they’d been trying to trade anyway because of his off-court issues.
And pot meeting kettle much? Are you not trying to justify your notion that Anthony is some kind of savior who will single handily will a team to competitiveness by asserting your own facts where they suit you? Despite the air of superiority you try to flaunt with your snarky commenting, and then disappearing act when people call you out on your absurd claims you never back up, you do pretty much the exact same things you go around accusing other commenters of.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by Gina on Nov 10, 2010 5:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
this is all silly
two teams went out and used whatever opportunity they had to get three superstars.
END OF STORY.
They are not dissimilar strategies. They are nearly identical. They cannot be identical, because there are not identical situations. There are opportunities that arise, but the same end-product was the goal: use what ever you have to get superstars.
SUPERSTARS is what matters. At the time, as you know, the Celtics were not that enamored of Rondo. In fact, two summers ago, AFTER the championship, the Celtics offered Rondo to the Nets.
It’s about getting SUPERSTAR talent. The rest of it is dross. Stop thinking linearly.
Oh, by the way, I know that is what Prokhorov would like.
The fact they're not identical situations is kind of the point
similar strategies doesn’t=similar models. Which is why you can’t assume they both work because Boston worked. The idea may be get superstars but it breaks down when you try to assume all superstars are somehow magically equal therefor the same eventual outcome can be assumed. Bosh is not KG, and because of that the heat have a major hole in their attempt that Boston didn’t have, just like Carmelo is not Lebron or Wade. If you want to talk about thinking linear thinking assuming it’s as simple as get superstars is about as linear as it can get. Because players aren’t equal and all superstars aren’t equal, because the term is one usually bestowed by the media. And because Carmelo, despite being a superstar in the media, isn’t near the same player Lebron and Wade are, and there’s years of research data and stats that show this. Just like Bosh isn’t near the same player KG is. And given that how can you possibly assert heat will work because Boston worked? And if that’s not what you’re trying to say, then what in the world are you trying to say? Because if you’re not assuming the heat will work, then obviously it’s not one identical model, or at least not a very good one, and there’s no reason to try and follow it rather than developing a better one.
And I don’t doubt you know what Prokhy would like, or at least have more insight than most commenters. But that’s irrelevant to my comment, what I’m talking about is in terms of what actual works and produces results on court.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by Gina on Nov 10, 2010 6:31 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Melo produces wins
And a ton of scoring. And a ton of fans. And New York loves him.
Not sure what else matters to an owner trying to revitalize a franchise with a horrid past.
Section 18, Row 7 at The Rock!
That's where I disagree
Scoring is great and if the NBA were a one-on-one league then Melo would be contending for a title every year, but as we know basketball is a team sport. I once saw Allen Iverson drop 40 points against Felipe Lopez and St. John’s and Georgetown still lost. Scoring doesn’t always equal wins.
Section 2 @ the Rock
Lol at deeming the Heat
a failure after 8 games. There is no question the Heat will contend for a title every year that those 3 are together.
Section 129 2010-2011 @ the ROCK
where did I deem them a failure?
I said they already had major holes Boston didn’t have. And that it makes no sense to deem them a success based purely on the fact Boston worked.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
Gina is right
That’s like me saying a CEO made tons of money…
A guy robbed a bank and made tons of money…
They both got a lot of money… IDENTICAL
You're missing the point
The end result will in all likelihood be the same and it will be because of the model. That was Net Income’s point.
Whati want to know from Gina is, do really believe that the Heat won’t win championships with the Big 3? Seems like that is what you are implying.
by imdkidd on Nov 10, 2010 7:15 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
If proky really believed in the Heat model
why didn’t he go after Amare.
The Knicks took the risk of getting amare because he was nearly dealt to cleveland at the trade deadline.
Thinking that could convince Lebron enough to sign with them.
They failed with Lebron but not with having other players who would love to join Amare.
CP3 and Melo.
The Knicks took a huge investment (a bad one) on Amare but it will likely lead to Melo. Which then is a win for them.
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 7:18 PM EST up reply actions
CP3 and melo are foolish
if they think that amare is the missing link to their big 3. lebron is a big 3 all by himself. having wade as a wingman is amazing. having bosh there… well, i hate his guts so i’ll leave it at that.
i’d take lebron, wade and 3 scrubs over CP3, melo, STAT and two scrubs.
besides… in three years when 3 all-stars have 2 functioning knees (and they both belong to melo) how big will that big three be?
I think the way the team is constructed now
I have a hard time seeing them being able to contend with any of the best teams from the west, especially the lakers, and I think even with superior perimeter players they may struggle to get past Orlando. I just don’t think they’re anywhere near as perfect a machine and compliment of skill sets as Boston was.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
we traded Kidd to Dallas before their championship didn't we
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
Pauls
goota feel stupid. And so do we, thinking trading Collison was such an awful thing
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
I never did
I thought that was a bad trade for everyone but the Nets. Collison is not having such a great year (that may change…he is a point guard). Lee is not contributing much more than he did with the Nets.
It was a risk for the Hornets, but for all the credit Monty Williams is getting, Dell Demps deserves a lot as well. Jason Smith is playing well. Craig Brackins isn’t playing. Belinelli is playing well. He made some very smart moves.
Kudos to him and you:)
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
I always liked Belinelli
Since I saw him in summer league drop I believe 37 he could shoot it but was also athletic and quick and could handle the ball, wonder if he would have been a better option than Morrow.
Nice to see GMs trying to accomodate their NBA players...
wait it doesn’t matter, CP3 is as good as gone anyway.
"I love what we have here. I love ‘Melo as a player and a person too. But would I change what we have here, if it was me?" "Probably not.'' -Johan Petro, future NBA GM.
Yeah also says the Rockets charlotte and Detroit can be an option
They might be able to get a nice piece back, we shall see.
Sounds like the man gets it
Don’t worry Prokhy, I’m sure at the next CBA negotiations, the owners are going to address this. Just don’t buy into it becoming a trend and don’t sell Favors short for a “me first” overhyped star, who struggles to get his team anywhere in the playoffs.
"I love what we have here. I love ‘Melo as a player and a person too. But would I change what we have here, if it was me?" "Probably not.'' -Johan Petro, future NBA GM.
i like Proky. He has some good luck. We should be 0-6 the way we played for most of Detroit and Sac. But then again, we should have Bosh, LeBron, and John Wall with his luck too :/
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
That rough start to the schedule with Miami twice and Orlando
I think messed up the confidence of some players most notably Lopez, because he started the season on fire and is now thinking to much, like D-wade is about to block him again or Howard is about to throw his shot.
on the other hand
the Nets has the longest opening homestand of any NBA team…four games…and of those four games, three of them were very winnable.
agreed
The charlotte loss was inexcusable.
This team should be at worst 3-4. They only have themselves to blame
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:32 PM EST up reply actions
Proky
Proky is one smart dude. But the new CBA may stem the tide against the owners and teams. In the end, it’s all about which team has THE HUMPH! OK…I’m being silly again, but PETRO is not laughing, at the end of the bench.
Paul from Delray Beach
is there anyway to stop this trend of superstars joining up
do you guys like this new trend, i think its bad for alot of small market teams
Maybe but the god thing is our location is decent and will get better in Brooklyn
We just need a respectable product on the court a team that fights every night, there aren’t many other places that players would want to play that has the finances to get things done.
Yes.
It is very bad for small market teams. Almost makes having a draft pointless.
I can’t wait until the franchise player becomes part of the NBA. Its going to create some parity in the NBA again.
"I love what we have here. I love ‘Melo as a player and a person too. But would I change what we have here, if it was me?" "Probably not.'' -Johan Petro, future NBA GM.
Oklahoma City and San Antonio
Oklahoma City is the SMALLEST market team. 45th largest market in the US.
San Antonio is a small market team. 38th largest market in the US.
Knicks on the other hand are by far the largest market team.
yeah but those teams were built using homegrown talent
if the NBA doesn’t make it harder for players to do what Miami’s big 3 did what will stop stud players from refusing to sign extensions once their rookie deal is up to go play with their buddies in a predetermined city?
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:34 PM EST up reply actions
Spurs tried to get Kidd as a max free agent
Which would’ve meant trading Tony Parker. Duncan drove Kidd around in his Benz and tried to convince him to sign with the Spurs.
Section 18, Row 7 at The Rock!
prokhorov may have a tough lesson to learn...
and its that peoples’ memories are not as short as desired.
it will take more than news of a billionaire owner building a billion $$ stadium. if we don’t get it done on the court, none of this non-basketball stuff matters
i should have been more clear...
when landing big name players and/or free agents… i think that a lot of the non-basketball “stuff” gets way more attention than it should (from our end). its obviously difficult to lure quality players to a good situation… let alone a horrible situation. if the changes that prokhorov is making to this franchise actually becomes tangible evidence through our teams ability to play on the court, then his status and buying power will realize their full potential. but until we win some games, we STILL might as well have ratner (did i cross a line there? sorry in advance)
Yeah we need everything
New arena, new players, new name, I was hoping we could get at least some new jersey for these next two years as well, its seems our stigma runs deeper than I thought.
Proky doesn't consider Favors a budding star???
Why does (nearly) everyone automatically assume Proky considers Melo the star that Nets need to acquire but not Favors as the star-in-waiting?
Outlaw is the new Yi - just with more money and longer contract without the 7.2 rebounds and occasional shooting streak.
Because Melo is a sure thing
One of the most prolific scorers in the NBA, that has set a ton of records pages long, that all of our players combined will never equal.
He’s won a National Championship in college. He’s never failed to make the playoffs in the NBA. He’s won internationally.
He’s a pure winner.
Favors, while I think will be good, is a prospect who may or may not one day be good. May or may not be a superstar.
Section 18, Row 7 at The Rock!
Yeah just forget that the sound of playing for us made him almost slap a reporter...lol
BRING AGENT ZERO To NEWARK/BROOKLYN!!! We Keep FAVORS/BROOK/DEVIN TOO! The JETS/NETS are coming!
Oh I'm sure
All of these professional GM’s and agents are pursuing a deal for weeks knowing he wouldn’t sign, but doing it just to ensure the players on their team are feeling the trade heat.
Ridiculous.
Section 18, Row 7 at The Rock!
Or Maybe just acting desperate and trying to make it appear as they are doing something to the rest of the League
The “NEW” model of bussiness was decided at the 2008 Olympics and that’s that. Bottomline. Melo was there with CP3 and the other superfriends. I am quite sure New Jersey wasn’t mentioned.
Melo wants a Knicks Jersey. No amount of posting will change that. Amare is HIS FRIEND!!! These new dudes need that re-assurance. They want their buddies. Only dudes from that 2008 Squad that aren’t like that were Kobe and Durant. Howard wants CP3 in Orlando too even if it costs Nelson and Carter.
We don’t have a “SuperFriend”. All those SUPER TEAMS STARTED WITH A TEAM HAVING ONE already. And HOME grown. Wade drafted by the HEAT and Paul pierce in Boston DRAFTED by the Celts. WE DON’T HAVE THAT GUY. LOPEZ ISN’T IT.
BRING AGENT ZERO To NEWARK/BROOKLYN!!! We Keep FAVORS/BROOK/DEVIN TOO! The JETS/NETS are coming!
has melo EVER sustained a major injury?
or better yet… how many games has he missed throughout his career? young bigs who are forced to get into action before they’re ready are far more likely to injure themselves or get injured. i know thats one reason why a “budding star” is still not a “star” in the way that carmelo anthony has spent the last 7+ years proving to the league that he is a “star”
instead of developing them
I think being patient and developing your own talent is a smarter route than chasing after this “model”, but hey.
IMO Miami and Boston did not give up a ton to get their core players, Al Jefferson excluded of course.
Best believe the Nets will have to pay a high price to become apart of the club.
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by MrDollarBills on Nov 10, 2010 5:58 PM EST up reply actions
And the rest of his quote goes like this:
And I saw my team and you know our junior Russian team could beat them. This Brook who I pay thousands a day, he is like toilet paper inside. Soft and airy. And this Devin is what these Americans call ADD: he plays good then bad and has no attention span for the game. If only Avery and I could suit up, then we would kick some borscht butt and show these people how to play. I like Farmar and T the Will: they are true russians. And that T the Will can smile too. I like Petro too but I think I signed him to wear a suit and look sharp behind the bench. Yes, a star for my team we need not named Lebron or D wade, but a star. Melo, yes, Melo is such a star. I will trade 25 rolls of my toilet paper players for this Melo.
Prokhy's next big investment
adderral for Devin?
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
it doesn't
make sense to trade for allen we don’t have another all star type star player. Please don’t bring up devin because he is not on the same level of Amare
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 6:02 PM EST reply actions
Predictions, anyone??
Closest one gets their comment turned green on this post.
Mine: 102- 93 Nets win
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.
It's a risk, no two ways about it
Trading for Carmelo will only work if somehow you can also get another guy, such as Chris Paul or Deron Williams. If you mortgage your future and don’t get TWO guys (not just one in Carmelo, but two, required to win a championship), then it’s a failed experiment.
Thus, it’s not just about getting Carmelo. Upon doing so, you are “all in” on getting yet ANOTHER star…or you flop by doing major long-term damage.
It’s a risk. But Prokhorov likes risk. It is what it is.
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
it's about BROOKLYN
2012-13. That’s when they want to have two stars.
Opening Night at the Barclays Center.
It’s pretty obvious.
Yeah, and you are on the clock once you get Melo to get that other star by that "sell by" date
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
And I know nobody wants to hear this
but Steve Nash can be had. Yes, yes, I know… but just putting this out there.
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
Painful
but while I’m on the subject of risk:
Favors + Murphy + picks for Melo
TWill + Harris for an aging Nash
etc.
It’s VERY risky, do I like it? No. Is it risky? Yes. Could I see this happening? Yes. It wouldn’t shock me. I think Prokhorov is in the business of taking risk.
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
I'm just thinking up something risky and painful but I could see happening & doable
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
that's what I been saying
That’s why I keep saying the Carmelo situation is KG situation all over. You have a star player who controls his future.
To Melo Brook doesn’t look as enticing as Amare or Carlos and Derrick Rose.
Same way with CP3 with naming the magic and the knicks.
These players want to play with establish players. Melo or CP3 do not want to wait for players to develop and etc etc.
So the Nets can inquire all they like about Melo but until they make another move nothing is happening.
KG told boston no it took them to get Ray Allen.
Even Proky knows that the miami and Boston blueprint is the future of the NBA right now
Since he knows that he should accept that Melo wants to go to NY or Chicago.
Focus on developing our talent so once the super team era is over we will be able to compete.
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 6:18 PM EST reply actions
interesting that you know that Prokhorov knows
Melo wants what you say he wants.
by Net Income on Nov 10, 2010 6:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You just speak as if you have inside knowledge
of Melo’s thinking. Your speculation differs from others but you push it as fact. If you would just admit there’s a chance that you’re wrong I would respect your opinion more.
Section 129 2010-2011 @ the ROCK
A chance I could be wrong
Melo controls his future. Same way KG did.
It doesn’t matter what I think or feel.
Melo is the one that has the Knicks and Bulls high on his list.
You people are the one that feel someone is going to settle instead of going with his first choice.
How logical is that.
KG went where he wanted same way Melo will
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 6:51 PM EST up reply actions
Let me ask you who is higher on Melo list
that’s all i have to say.
Proky is the one double talking.
He said one thing when he over paid a bunch of role players but I guess he is releasing this statement to help fans understand why he is willing to trade a player like Favors.
If he felt like this from the jump why didn’t he go after Amare.
As I said alot of double talk going on
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 6:49 PM EST up reply actions
Melo's extension won't be near as onerous as Amare's uninsured $100 million
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
what kadafi is saying is that if Prokhy wants stars then he should have paid Amar'e
to make it easier to land Carmelo, and that it doesn’t make sense to chase Carmelo with the current roster if the idea is to acquire multiple stars.
mediocrity thy name is Wilpon- jdon (and Billy King-Paul G B)
Official Member of the "DO NOT TRADE DERRICK FAVORS" Movement
by Gina on Nov 10, 2010 6:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Ok, well Prokhorov wants to start the domino effect later on down the timeline
What do you want me to say? lol
Nets = Global
Knicks = Local
Proky is doing double talk
he messed by over paying outlaw Morrow and Petro.
Now he sees the team is not as good as he thought.
He sees Melo has eyes on teams with establish stars and he is worried.
If he felt stars were so important why didn’t the Nets over pay amare?
He screwed up.
That’s all to it.
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 6:54 PM EST up reply actions
of course he isn't
but he is enough to make Melo and CP3 considered the crappy Knicks
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 6:54 PM EST up reply actions
What be honest I am
then again I wouldn’t trade Favors for Melo either.
I’m fine where we are. I rather us look to draft to answer our SF question
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 6:21 PM EST reply actions
think about this...
if this team continues to SUCK, winning 25 games and getting another pick and more hope rather than productivity, will Lopez stick around?
You’d better start thinking about it because you can be sure he and his agent are.
The same way I feel
Wishing and looking towards the draft is fools gold, the best thing to do is be competitive this year, develop our players, and look to maybe make a small trade to get us into the playoffs. We can’t keep struggling loosing and having the rest of the NBA view us a joke. If we happen to fall into a high seed in the draft it is what it is but the draft should never be the focus, thats a losers mentality one which we have to change.
Well honestly Netincome
Lets look at it like this
Proky is saying all this now.
Now let me be Devil’s Advocate if he is saying all this, why did he not go after Amare????
(Now I feel the deal Amare sign with the Knicks was horrible.) Let’s be 100 would Melo and CP3 even considered The Knicks if Amare is not on the roster???
I mean it seems like Proky is doing one thing, saying this then saying that.
When we failed to get any big free agent he releases a statement saying we will build slow and around lopez
Then he sees in the summer two all star player look to be traded name a team that like his was not in the playoffs is not very good as well. (what is the difference? Amare)
Now he sees Melo is high on NY so now all of sudden he feels that this is where the NBA headed??
If he felt that way and if he felt that Boston set the blueprint?
Why didn’t the Nets follow it?
Boston had to get Ray Allen for KG to even considered them.
Melo is not going want the Nets when Amare is in New York and Boozer and Rose is in the Chi.
I’m not saying we should have sign amare but it’s alot of double talk going around.
He over paid for bench and role players. This is the bed he and Avery made. They have to sleep in it now.
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 6:35 PM EST up reply actions
he didnt to after Amare
for the same reason why the Suns didnt offer Amare what the Knicks offered him: that as Steve Kerr said medical histories show that players who have microfracture surgery three years later wind up either done or with such low productivity as to be worthless. PERIOD.
You build up all these scenarios based on some single factoid that even though it conflicts with other facts. There have been reports that Melo is willing to come to New Jersey, that Jay-Z met with William Wesley on this. Not to mention the possibility that the Nets are not just expending all this time and effort on a pipedream, that they have actual indications that he would sign. You don’t know what Melo has told ANYONE. You think you know. You suggest as well that Prokhorov knows that Melo wants New York. And by the way if the Knicks lose multiple picks as a result of the workkout problem, as Woj reports is likely, will Melo be as enamored as you think he is? Would you like to posit that it won’t matter to Melo?
Here’s the bottom line. There are a lot of people here who accept whatever argument available to justify saying the Nets shouldn’t pursue Melo and/or not trade Favors. I will accept either because the Nets offense is NON EXISTENT right now, just as bad as it was last season…and unlikely to get much better without a great offensive force. If they don’t get Melo and keep Favors, I hope he succeeds.
But I am NOT going to make arguments that a guy who has an NCAA championship, Olympic gold and silver medals, and has been to the playoffs every season has been in the league is not a winner. THAT is ridiculous on its face.
Nor am I going to suggest that I KNOW what Prokhorov is thinking (even though I have a great advantage or two in this area).
by Net Income on Nov 10, 2010 6:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Please do not mention
Hova anymore after the Lebron situation his connections and friendships resembles those in the music industry.
I am going by that Melo and Cp3 both inquired about trades and list a common team at the top. The crappy Knicks.
Which only proves what Proky said. These players are looking to join other players. Amare.
With that said. If Proky really believes what he is saying now why didn’t he go after Amare. As I said before Boston had to get Ray after KG rejected them.
I can only go by what comes out of Melo mouth.
He praises both the Knicks and Bulls and say bluntly “I never said I wanted to play for the Nets.”
It is what it is. I’m not against getting Melo without giving up Favors.
As I said before it’s alot of double talking go on right now though.
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 7:00 PM EST up reply actions
stop with amare...
its been said ad nauseum that his knees raise a lot of concerns. if anything, proky was smart for not going after amare. and if we did… where would favors be on our depth chart?
No
because the point is Porky is saying stars want to play with other stars.
He is saying that.
the point is amare is drawing interest of Melo and CP3.
The point is if Proky really felt like this he didn’t do nothing.
He is saying Boston set the example. well Boston got Ray Allen which led to KG considering them.
Now again from what we seen so far who is following the Boston blueprint
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 7:23 PM EST up reply actions
prokhorov is an intelligent business man.
he was not willing to invest $100 million in ONE PLAYER who could be useless by the time we’re in brooklyn. how can you find fault in this?
in a decade, maybe less, fans and players alike will be looking back on this period of the NBA as that time when friendship meant more than winning, and all will share a collective laugh. these guys are running around like a bunch of kids, playing favorites, not wanting to be picked last for dodge ball, taking their ball and going home… etc. its all childish.
who said I found fault
I said Proky is doubling talking.
He said when we over paid outlaw petro we were rebuilding around lopez.
Now Melo and Cp3 show interest into horrible Knicks. who haven’t been in the playoffs in how long?
The point is Amare is drawing interest of two of the leagues top players as Proky said stars want to play with other establish players.
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 7:43 PM EST up reply actions
if calling out prokhorov for double talking isn't finding fault....
then i give up. you win. it also seems like you view amare going to the knicks as a Nets failure.
showing interest (a.k.a. feeling left out in the biggest summer the NBA has ever seen) in creating a third Big 3… a big east big three trifecto-mania is the popular thing to do. it doesn’t mean its going to happen, and it doesn’t mean that this is the only way to win a title anymore.
if prokhorov wants a star, he needs to start paying more attention to brook lopez. he’s on the cusp.
then give up
I find fault that he is switching his stories.
Stick to one thing.
Don’t bs me.
Don’t say the reason you sign and over paid Outlaw and Petro. Went out to get morrow and Farmer was because you were building to Lopez strengths. That you surround him with shooters so once he is double he passes out of it.
Don’t tell me we are on a five year plan and once he sees Melo and Cp3 eying the competition that goes out the window.
I have said many times that contract for amare is horrible but if it gets the Knicks Melo and Cp3. it was worth it.
Heck when the last time you seen players of melo and Cp3 statue say I want to go to NY or even interested???
amare is to key to that.
Melo controls his future he can go to any team of his choice. So I see him as Knick more likely than Cp3.
You are right a new big three is not guaranteed a ship but at the same time Proky is saying this is the future. What I’m asking is if he felt like this why did you do what you do in the off season?
It makes no sense.
Boston didn’t get ray allen because they felt he was the missing piece they got Ray to show KG he would help along side Pierce.
Cause KG felt that pierce and him wasn’t enough. When they acquire Ray Allen that was enough.
The Knicks didn’t sign Amare because he is franchise player. They got desperate and thought that could entice Lebron.
Miami had the biggest advantage during the summer. They already had Wade and enough sign two more.
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 10, 2010 8:11 PM EST up reply actions
you said it.
The Knicks didn’t sign Amare because he is franchise player. They got desperate and thought that could entice Lebron.
True
but amare the signing of Amare is working for the Knicks. The same way they felt it would lead to Lebron interested in NY it has left Melo and CP3 interested in coming there. so it is working to that degree
by killa kadafi191 on Nov 11, 2010 3:02 AM EST up reply actions
He never got out of the first round without
the help of an NBA Finals MVP…what kind of winner is that?
"I love what we have here. I love ‘Melo as a player and a person too. But would I change what we have here, if it was me?" "Probably not.'' -Johan Petro, future NBA GM.
by Nets4Life on Nov 11, 2010 12:53 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No Twill or Murphy tonight
Hopefully with Murph inactive, our own STAR will play meaningful minutes.
Its so sad that the biggest game we've played in
The last few years is the game to not break the record for the fewest wins in a season, that has to change, our mentality needs to change that its not ok to loose, no more metal lapses.
Psychic Toast says the Nets get a W tonight
book it
79-3
by CinnamonToastCrunch on Nov 10, 2010 7:03 PM EST reply actions
hmmmm.... delicious!
does the “clairvoyant loaf” have anything to say about melo’s future? cause i know a few posters that would love to settle it now LOL
Let me sum it up
Get Melo without trading Favors or Lopez, we win.
Get Melo by trading Favors, perrenial lower seed playoff team unless we luck out and get a real PF before 3 years.
Stand pat. Lottery team at least for the next two years. All of you preaching “we are OKC East” can stuff it.
by imdkidd on Nov 10, 2010 7:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
: D
ill bet anyone, that if we do not land Melo or another player and don’y make playoffs, we land the 1st pick
to put this all in perspective...
Seattle Received:
- 5th overall pick (jeff green)
- delonte west
- wally szerbiak
Minnesota got:
- gerald green
- ryan gomes
- sebastian telfair
- theo ratliff
- cash
- two picks (one top-3 protected)
- al jefferson (stud at the time)
celtics get:
Kevin Garnett
Ray Allen
an NBA championship.
this is what teams are willing to give up for a star… and for a championship.
Hint
Melo then someone like CP3 later on?
Proky has defended the LeBron move for a reason.
If Melo signs with Nets, it could be because Melo’s people heard that Proky is a good guy.
Prokhorov is not just a genius billionaire especially if he can take time and defines the little aspects in the NBA after watching the Nets play but he is also a keen NBA lover or should I say basket ball lover because he does comparison with the Russian game.
Michael Jordan is not God
by ferronsebastien on Nov 11, 2010 11:38 AM EST reply actions
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