Nets CFO: We'll Be Among NBA's Most Valuable in Brooklyn

No…wait a minute…but…Brooklynbob said…oh wait now I get it. GO BROOKLYN!!

As long as the Nets stay in the NJ/NY area im happy….

I’m not against a move to Brooklyn and I understand that Nets fans in Jersey will travel to NY if need be, but how many New Yorkers are there that will actually go to these games? Don’t the Knicks have this demographic already?

We’ll need a lot of front-runners I guess?

There will be no fan base in Brooklyn, either. It will be half-filled with corporate boxes who don’t care about the team or little kids rooting for the opposing teams star.

But, at least the stadium will have better lighting.

Yes because you know more than top CEO’s who are billionaires, all the sponsors who are making major investments in this project and the top researches who do this for a living. Stop stating your own opinion as fact.

Once again you don’t have to be Net fan to go to a Net game. I hate the Knicks and go to roughly 5 maybe even 7 games a year. It’s entertaiment and fun. People in Brooklyn will love going to see basketball as will I.

Yes, because as we all know, CEO’s know everything and have really done a great job the past couple years of running their businesses.

@ Big Davey88:
There isn’t a NY demographic. NY is made up of a bunch of different demographics. There are probably more kids (13 and under) who have never seen the Knicks win a single playoff game and are more likely to root for Lebron than the Knicks.

There are probably more transient 20-something hipsters who are more likely to root for their home team than the Knicks.

There are probably more recent immigrants who are more likely to root for the star of their homeland (like Yao or even Drazen back in the day) than the Knicks.

Others are more inclined to root for national teams like the Celtics and Lakers than the Knicks.

Others will just jump on the bandwagon of whichever team happens to be good. The Yankees have been drawing better than the Mets for about 15 years now. But back when the Mets had Gooden, Strawberry, Hernandez, Carter, Cone, they constantly outdrew the Yanks. Constantly outdrew them back when they had Seaver and Koosman too.
 
On top of all that, there are still a few who remember the Nets from their Dr. J days and still root for them. Dr. J was slighly before my time, but I grew up a Nets fan simply b/c it rhymed with Mets and Jets. Also liked the stars and stripes unees back then.

I’m sure some old timers, those who remember Reed, Frazier and Bradley would never-ever-ever abandon the Knicks. But what % of hoops fans do they make up?

PS: Brooklynites are a proud bunch. Slap on the Brooklyn name to a jersey, and that alone will win over many local fans of all ages/ethnicities.

Brooklyn has a large number of Knicks fans that won’t convert just because the Nets move there. If they are truly loyal to the Knicks, then they will stay with the Knicks. The only people who support this plan are the groups like ACORN and BUILD, which Ratner personally funds. After hearing the latest news, this should just die already, because it’s pretty much past life support.

@Larry Brown

Well they got in this position for a reason don’t you think?

But regardless i’m pretty sure they would have looked into something like how well they would draw. That’s kind of important when your thinking of moving a multi billion dollar franchise to a new area. Rather than just assuming something like you just did.

All of you are speculating without an ounce of knowledge.

I am always amazed at the internet and how its two qualities always seem to be in conflict. On one hand, it gives people a voice and on the other it provides a wealth of data. However, in most cases, those who want that voice don’t take advantage of the data available. There are such things as marketing surveys, financial projections. They have been made part of various submissions to the Empire State Development Corp. as part of the approval process for the arena.

Do you people actually believe that the Nets ownership, which has invested hundreds of millions of dollars in the move to Brooklyn, didn’t secure marketing data, didn’t make projections prior to making that investment, don’t know what the range of acceptance will be among fans in New York and New Jersey?

New York is not a demographic?! Oh please stop. That is just tiresome and silly.

@NetIncome

Why are you talking like that? With facts?!! Yuck! What’s wrong with you? Use your own biased opinion which is based on absolutely nothing like everyone else!!

sarcasm off

@ NI:
NY is not a (SINGLE) demographic. I explain a few of the many groups which make up the diverse fan base within the city and why it’s not simply a Knick’s town the way SLC is a Jazz’ town. The fact that Brooklyn is NOT a homogenous area makes it more likely that the Nets would succeed here.

@ Tal:
I say “here” b/c I actually live in Brooklyn. When was the last time you even stepped foot in the boro of Kings?

back to NI:
What’s Stiffins up to? I remember speculating about him sucking. How’s my knowledge on that one?

@BrooklynJohnny

Cite some facts to support that assertion. And if so, how is New York different from other locations? Moreover, if New York isn’t one demographic as you claim, that would argue for the Nets’ belief that they can compete with the Knicks in that with such diversity, some new fans can be lured to the Nets?

BrooklynJohnny, I have been to Brooklyn numerous times before the talk of the Atlantic Yards complex. I have made several visits to the Brooklyn Museum, Coney Island Amusement Park, Prospect Park, and even the Brooklyn Heights Prommenade. A number of events involving the Atlantic Yards have brought me into neighborhoods including Downtown Brooklyn, Brooklyn Hieghts, Boreum Hill, Prospect Heights, Park Slope, Cobble Hill, Crown Heights, Williamsburg, and Bedford-Stuyvesant. For the record, I have been to Brooklyn in the past, so I suggest you don’t make those unwarranted assumptions. On a sidenote it goes as “set foot”, not “stepped foot” as you said it.

I forgot to mention that I have also been to Fort Greene, Weeksville, and Clinton Hill when going to Brooklyn.

I have been to Tehran, Havana, Rejkavik, Moscow, Stockholm, Buenos Aires, Sydney, Karachi, Jerusalem, Rio de Janiero, Cape Town, Riyadh and Elizabeth, NJ. I don’t consider myself an expert in any of them.

1977-2000: Nets are one of the most miserable franchises in the NBA. Nobody in their right mind would bother moving this team, never mind investing in them

2001-2003: Nets secure 2 NBA Finals berths, have become an East powerhouse

2004: Bruce Ratner, Billionaire developer buys Nets, without actually have much interest in the NBA. Simultaneously, the Knicks are terrible and have been since 2000. Ratner says Nets will move to Brooklyn. Did he think that since the Knicks sucked there would be major interest in another NY team?

2005: Nets still playing in NJ, no visible progress in brooklyn

2006: Nets still playing in NJ, secondary “NJ” logo no longer used, no visible progress in brooklyn

2007: Nets still playing in NJ, grey alternate jerseys “new jersey” are replaced with red “nets” alternates. The red are worn every game @NY. Marketing to NY? Yormark adamant about brooklyn move, no visible progress in brooklyn

2008: Nets still playing in NJ,Yormark adamant about brooklyn move, no visible progress in brooklyn

2009: Nets still playing in NJ, announce preseason games in Newark, NJ, Yormark adamant about brooklyn move. Newark Mayor announces he wants nets in Newark, NJ, no visible progress in brooklyn other than a hole with rats in it.

2010: Nets still playing in NJ, play 3 preseason games in Newark NJ, one in queens

2011: Nets still playing in NJ, Lebron does not sign with Nets (it won’t happen people)

so it seems the three things that have stayed constant since ratner took over:
Nets play in NJ, Yormark adamant about brooklyn move, No visible progress in brooklyn. Bottom line: I don’t believe a word anyone employed by the Nets says about brooklyn. There’s nothing to back them up, and they’re being paid by the man who wants to move them. Nobody’s going to admit that “it doesn’t look like brooklyn’s going to happen” unless the team gets sold. Then I’ll start believing anything were told about this team.

Just because Ratner is still investing doesn’t mean that it will happen. Just about everyone knows that he will continue doing this until he faces reality that it won’t happen. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure that out. Before this, there were reports saying that the move to Brooklyn is less likely to happen on the previous entries here. Of course Ratner doesn’t like to admit that he lost, so he will just continue riding it until he can’t put it on life support any longer. On a sidenote, I forgot to mention Greenpoint as one of the many Brooklyn neighborhoods I have been just to disproove BrooklynJohnny that I have been there in the past, though I doubt he has ever been to Newark recently.

I could draw up an alternate chronology that would include things like Kenyon Martin demands trade and then huge payout to push trade demand; Nets payroll reaches record levels three years running under Ratner; critics delay construction.

You act as if this is some sort of conspiracy. If Ratner truly believed Brooklyn wasn’t going to happen, he would have sold…and he’s had at least one reported offer in the summer of 2007.

@ NI:
Being that I’m about to go out, I don’t have the time to provide links proving Bk’s diversity. For now you’ll just hafta take my word for it. When this topic comes up again, which will prolly be in another 2/3 days, I’ll add more.

Just so ya know, I AM saying that due to its diversity there is incredible room for the Nets here. I’m also saying that aside from those who grew up on Reed-Frazier-Bradley, the Knick fan base isn’t all that loyal. Even Brooklyn’s most famous Knick fan, Spike Lee, has given much more camera time to Michael Jordon, Ray Allen, and now w/his most recent doc, Kobe Bryant than he has to any Knick.

@ Tal:
Apologies for jumping on ya. Looks like you’ve hit all corners. Hope ya come back. Especially once the Nets are in town!

The Barclays Center subway/LIRR station is two stops from Wall Street, which although wounded is not dead, and one stop from Chinatown…and if Yi is still playing (hope he is because that would mean he has developed) that could be a rich pool to mine.

And why do people forget about Nassau and Suffolk counties? That LIRR line makes games a lot easier to get to.

Finally, as I keep trying to tell people, by controlling the Barclays Center, the Nets owners will have additional revenue streams, not just concessions and parking, but event fees from concerts and family shows. There will be 224 dates available BEYOND the NBA games.

This is all a bunch of crap. Brooklyn is not going to happen, ever. Ratner doesn’t care about winning…see Kenyon Martin non-signing. They will cut costs everywhere, and need to continue promising that Brooklyn will happen, for the sake of the stockholders. It’s a circle. Bad attendance, in a bad arena——-no money to pay better players and a better coach——bad attendance and unhappy fans——-no money to pay better players——-and on and on and on.

Come on guys. Because the Nets CFO isn’t biased, right? His word means JACK.

Net Income, in the last months there were talks about having the Nets have a deal that they could go to Newark without being penalized. If the move to Brooklyn was more believable, that wouldn’t be the case. It’s obvious that both Booker and Vanderbeek known that Ratner is in bad shape, which is why they are working on that deal with Corzine to have the Nets in Newark.

BrooklynJohnny, I have also been to Red Hook, Ditmas Park, Gravesend, and Northside.

Guys – I used to live in Brooklyn, then lived for a while in Manhattan and now live in Jersey. I was a fan of the Nets while living in all of those places, with season tickets from my Manhattan days till today. 98% of my friends are from NYC, Westchester and Long Island. I would say that there is probably a relatively equal split between Knicks and Nets fans in this group of 50 guys (friends dating back to college at Albany). And of the Knicks fans – most will watch the Nets because the Nets always played an exciting style of basketball (at least in the JKidd era) and then got a high flying superstar in VC.

I remember the first summer when the Cyclones moved to Coney Island. I hate the Mets, and have 0 interest in Single A baseball…..but I was angling for tickets from day 1 (which were impossible to come across). Going to a game at Coney Island was a huge deal – like a big social event. For anyone who knows Brooklyn, getting to Coney Island for a 7pm game in the summer is NOT easy. There is the prospect of sitting in traffic on the Belt, a very long subway ride from Manhattan or Park Slope, or dealing with inner borough traffic. Yet it was always sold out.

Hopefully this does not ban me from this site – but aside from being a Nets fan – my day job is a prop trader on Wall Street (this essentially means trading a book for an internal hedge fund managed by a large Investment Bank). Most Investment Bank headquarters are on Park Avenue in the mid 40s to low 50s. Grand Central is a 5 minute walk from the majority of the offices. The 4 train to Atlantic/Pacific would be about 20 minutes. For anyone who works on the exchange, the walk to the 4 train is about 3 minutes with a 7 minute subway ride. Getting to Penn (MSG) from the 40s and Park requires 2 different subway trains (with a transfer at Times Square) or sitting in gridlocked traffic to get across town. Combined with the fact that if they build this arena in Brooklyn it will have every conceivable ammenity and the Nets already have a good young core of players, combined with multiple picks over the next 2 years.

Trust me – the Nets will draw if they go to Brooklyn. Wall Street will be healed by the time this arena opens – and every major bank will have a box. They will have no trouble selling tickets to NYC corporations. There are millions of people who live in Brooklyn – many of whom are basketball fans. And Brooklyn has a lot of pride – people will flock to games simply to see Brooklyn across the jersey. Plus with Jay-Z associated with this team – Brooklyn jerseys will be a staple of the hip hop world – hence a top selling jersey in Idaho, Bejing, Barcelona, Moscow, etc.

I am hoping that this move happens – and I have to believe that if the move was not going to happen – Ratner would have sold the team already and cut his losses. Oh, and you don’t think the city of NY is salivating at the jobs that will be created during the construction of this area (arena, apartment/office buildings, expanded transit infrastructure, parking garages, etc) along with the permanent jobs that will be created in and around the arena. That means millions of dollars in tax revenues that the city is desperately trying to attract. I would bet that Bloomberg and Patterson are desperately trying to attract Federal stimulus money to get this arena project built. Money and politics will always win out in the end over community opposition groups.

NJ4Life Says – YES! Thank you for pointing out so much of the garbage Ratner and Yormark have been spewing at us. In addition to removing the NJ alternate logo and adding those hideous red raod jerseys that replaced “New Jersey” with “Nets” and don’t forget they have branded this team as Nets Basketball instead of the New Jersey Nets – even becoming the only team in the league that does not mention where the team actually plays on its media guide and yearbook bindings! It is ridiculous, we are tired of being spit on Ratner – you deserve to go bankrupt and live like the rest of the us that are just trying to scrounge up enough money to be ripped off by horrendous owners like you that destroy professional franchises.

Mierswa, money, Show Me the Money. Brooklyn isn’t going to happen. Right now Brooklyn is just a pipe dream. Your dream will be eroded by time like 5-10 years to raise that fund. In the meanwhile the logical place, THE ROCK will be the Nets place once Ratner comes to his senses.

Yes the logical place. The place that can’t even sell out NJ Devil playoff games. The Rock is a joke there were ton of open seats when I watched them in the playoffs.

Harold,

Just checked the Prudential Center attendance for their 1st round playoff series against Carolina, and all four games were sellouts. Please, whether you lie or make assumptions about these things, it just makes you look bad. Please don’t post when you can easily be shot down. Thank you. Here’s the link, if you don’t believe me…

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/teams/schedule?team=njd&year=2009&season=3

Harold,

Please show me the proof that says the Devils didn’t sell out the Carolina series? Regardless, the NBA is much more popular than the NHL, especially in this area, so it’s not really an apples to apples comparison.

Ryan,

The government can’t “create” jobs without taking from someone else. If Ratner wanted to move the team to BK with his OWN money, fine. But he needs the state to force people out of their homes and he needs the state to force taxpayers to pay for his real estate project.

If it’s such a great investment, why can’t he get private financing? Why must he force ordinary citizens to front the bill with cash and their property?

BrooklynBound,

Harold’s assertion can’t be substatiated, b/c it’s simply not true. I just posted a link shooting his statement down. Unfortunately, these blog sites provide a forum for people like Harold and Net Income who post whatever they want, regardless of the facts. Some people simply shouldn’t be taken seriously.

That’s fine. I guess there just a lot “no shows” because regardless of what that link shows there were A LOT of empty seats. Watch a replay of a Devil playoff game or two and you’ll see. I don’t appreciate being called a liar but I do stand corrected and apologize for it.

If you’ve ever been to the Rock, you know that there are other things to do there other than sit in your seat. There are bars and restaurants, and you can watch the game from anywhere in the arena, with all of the LCD TV screens. Couldn’t that be why you saw some empty seats? And if you’re not a liar, than you did make assumptions, which you may not want to do in the future, when it’s so easy to find info to counter what you say.

@Mr. T

Seriously? Because I saw a lot of empty seats on tv at the Devil’s game and assumed they struggled to sell tickets (which is reasonable imo) I shouldn’t be taken seriously? Shut your mouth. I apologized because evidently I was wrong but just because you disagree with what I have to say doesn’t mean I shouldn’t be taken seriously.

BTW: Say whatever you want about me because i’m not an expert on the matter and never pretended to be but NetIncome know’s what he’s talking about. He’s posted FACTS instead of biased stupidity like some.

Excuse my ignorance but where in that link does it saying anything about attendance? It’s the Devils post season schedule with stats from the game. I don’t see anything on attendance.

You still assumed, and if you think Net Income is unbiased in his/her posts, I know writing to you any further is a waste of my time.

I am now finished with you.

He’s obviously in favor of the arena going forward but at least he posts links/facts instead of stating his opinion as fact.

Give an example of where NetIncome flip flopped please. I would like to see it.

I’m still waiting for your proof on the sell outs. If i’m wrong then so be it and i’ll take responsibility for my post but that link proves nothing.

There was just an article published yesterday on the NY Times that talked even more about having the Nets play in Newark. It also speaks of saying that Barclays Center, if it does end it getting built, will not be ready until 2013, which will be even later than when Yormark planned it. Again, if the move to Brooklyn was more believable, the deal to bring them to Newark wouldn’t be occurring right now. There is my proof that they will end up in Newark rather than Brooklyn, On a sidenote, another Brooklyn neighborhood I have been to was Prospect-Lefferts Gardens where Ebbets Fields used to be.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/03/nyregion/new-jersey/03arenanj.html

If they break ground this summer, there’s absolutely no way it takes them 3 1/2 – 4 years to build the arena. Opening up in 2011 is realistic from what Yormark stated earlier.

Actually I misread that, it says 2012 is the best opening date, while 2013 stated when the lease at the Meadowlands ends. Either way, even if they could break ground this year, I doubt that it would be ready by 2011. There have been numerous estimates disprooving that. Knowing that Ratner is in bad shape in his stocks and nothing occurred for the arena, all the opposition needs to do is run out the clock since time is on their side since they are pretty much leading. If he doesn’t get a ground breaking by the end of this year, it’s pretty much in the coffin.

If there’s no ground breaking by the end of the year it’s definetly without a doubt over because I think all the bonds and loans and all of that is due or expired. That’s why it’s critical to do it this year and why it would be insanely stupid for Yormark to lie right now when the truth will be coming out one way or another in a few weeks. It would be downright stupid.

Yea, because no high-ranking officials ever lie until they’re proven wrong… please

Name me a buisness man who had a project contingent upon a court hearing, that continued to lie even though he knew the project was dead, put his reputation on the line, lied to roughly 20 sponsors, put tens of millions into that project, turned down a huge offer from another franchise to continue to pursue this project for this franchise and has had as much success as Yormark! Anyone??? NOPE! Don’t make generalizations like that please. Not every man who’s had success making a ton of money is a piece of trash. I admit that Ratner is a shady man but Yormark is not.

We don’t know Yormark isn’t shady. CEOs are going to fight until the bitter end. If this project doesn’t happen, Yormark will have scapegoats to blame. He’s saying what he’s supposed to be saying.

We do know that Yormark isn’t a shady guy because he’s had many opportunities to leave and cut his losses (if there were any) and move on. He stayed with us because he believes in this project and he has a very good reason to believe it will happen evidently. People seem to foregt that Yormark is losing a lot of money every year we’re at the Izod too. Yet he said there’s “absolutely no chance” of the Nets playing at the Rock long term.

Ratner has proven himself to be shady with dealing with shady characters and going about things the wrong way in certain situations. Yormark is a clan cut hard working guy who has done nothing but great things for the Nets. Anyone who could get 20+ diffferent sponsors to support and arena that has made no progress for 5 or 6 years is just insanely good. The man know’s his stuff that’s for sure.

Harold, I can’t honestly think even you believe the things you are posting on here. Even if Yormark were the remarkable business man to present him to be, that makes him a good person? Give me a break – he is slimy snake and has treated the real fans of the New Jersey Nets like utter garbage since he came back to this team.

Ok. How bout when he said, (paraphrasing) “We will not be playing any preseason games in Newark next year”? He must have seemed so sincere to you when he said that. Imagine your surprise when it was announced that we WOULD be playing three preseason games there. I don’t care how many sponsors he’s gotten. It doesn’t mean he’s on the straight and narrow. For all you know, he promised those sponsors big $ once the team “goes to bklyn”. In which case he’d be lying if he could say with 100% certainty that it’s going to happen. Don’t be so naive.

Your right and that’s fair but we’re also playing games somewhere in NYC. I can’t remember where it said. He went back on what he said but this isn’t a big deal, it won’t ruin his reputation with countless amounts of companies and big buisnessmen. Moving to Newark after all of this…yeah he would be worthless in a lot of peoples eyes.

This is a very minor thing that will be bringing in a nice chunk of cash for him I believe as opposed to just playing them at the Izod where if they don’t LOSE a big chunk of cash it’s a success. Also if you remember they said the income they’re getting from the pre-season games in Newark will not be very much. That just gave them more incentive to push for Brooklyn.

@ Harold,

One would have to assume that Prudential Center paid the Nets a good amount of money to play at Pru Center for 2 games…
who knows how much they will make on the gate sales, merch sales….
Def worth it for the Nets

I’m sorry I missed the last part of that post:

Of course he promised these companies big money for supporting them. Why else would they put thier name on a project that isn’t even close to being built? If it went under it would only look negative on thier respective companies.

I’m not being naive. Don’t you think that all of these people know what they’re doing? Of course they do. Nobody is gonna ruin their reputation, thier companies name or invest a ton of thier own money like they have been on a shakey project that is dead behind the scenes.

I keep saying this and coming back but there really isn’t any sense in talking about this because do or die we’ll know the Brooklyn arena’s fate soon enough.

I’m not saying I know anything about what they will be bringing in from this but i’m just repeating what Yormark came out and said.

The Nets will get a small percentage from things like that. That’s why actually owning the arena rather than renting it has such a huge advantage. If this were happening in Brooklyn, Ratner would have most of this go straight into his wallet along with all the other co-owners.

Harlod, no investors would be lost just because they end up having the Nets in Newark. Also, Ratner wouldn’t have to give up ownership of the Nets either unless he wants to end it just because his idea failed. They can work a deal that will make them co-owners, which is what Vanderbeek is hoping for in which there would be no need to be tennants. Also, don’t repeat what Ratner and Yormark are saying, because I can always look that up, so try to say this in your own words on why you still think it will happen.

You keep talking about how these companies wouldn’t take such a risk. Don’t you think that makes a good businessman? Someone who takes risks and hopes to the cards fall right. That’s the name of the game. You don’t get anywhere by playing it safe. Hence why even before the brooklyn deal is pronounced dead, the mayor of newark is petitioning to bring the team to his city. Its a gamble on his part since he doesn’t know if the project will even fall through. So don’t tell me companies looking to make some money in a terrible economy aren’t going to play a hand where the stakes are a billion dollar arena and the profits it could potentially hold.

And as far as pre-season revenue? I expect the games to be sold out, so there will be more money than ANY preseason game at IZOD and if tickets are priced close to a regular season game, you should have a comparable draw to a nj/ny game at izod.

@ Tal Barzilai

I’m only quoting Yormark because he know’s a lot more than any of us do. I’ve been saying for months why I think this will happen.

Just another point before I go, the income Ratner would get by himself in Broolyn compared to the percentage he would get in Newark as a co-owner or whatever isn’t comparable. The numbers would be miles apart. Ratner and Yormark know that and that’s why they’re pushing so hard for this arena to get done. You add in the non-basketball events at the Brooklyn arena and it REALLY blows Newark away.

Making a petition to draw attention to bringing a sports franchise to your state and investing tens of millions and putting your company name on an arena that behind the scenes is really dead is completely different. Of course you have to take risks but according to some here the arena is already dead (which it isn’t) so spending money on a project that is dead, isn’t too smart is it? That’s exactly my point. These guys know exactly what’s going on and that’s why they’re teaming with Ratner and Yormark. It’s a risk because the project is shakey but once again it is NOT dead!

I fully expect it to sell out. If it doesn’t it will be a MASSIVE failure on the part of the fans who wanna show the Nets their support. You can’t compare the income they would get at Newark to the income they would get in Brooklyn. That was my point. Like I said, if they don’t lose a chunk of cash at the Izod it’s a success.

yawn

My issue with the Nets moving is that they are only taking a risk to the extent that they are getting massive taxpayer subsidies. Also, they are forcing people out of their homes for a private investment. If it’s such a good deal, they would be able to find private outside investors to buy the property outright, they wouldn’t need the goverment to force people out.

Also regarding Yormark’s reputation, if this thing doesn’t go through, he has the biggest scapegoat of all-time: the economy.

Yawn?… Yawn? Good arguement. It’s just as well though because i’m pretty sick of talking about this

@ BrooklynBound

Your right but after talking the way he did, if this arena somehow did fail, it would still be a massive knock to his reputation as a buisnessman. There’s no way Yormark can afford to talk the way he did just to later give up on the project. He’s not that stupid and that’s why I believe him.

Harold, the entire complex won’t be comming out of Ratner’s wallet, it will be out of every taxpayer living the state of NY, while he won’t have to give anything for it. This is the reason why I oppose it so much. Many would agree with me that they do not want to use their taxdollars to help make a rich man feel richer. Another thing to keep in mind that the arena has to be in use almost daily, and I doubt that local schools will ever get to use it on a regular basis except for PSAL Championships as if they could with MSG as Markowitz keeps on saying. As for Newark, even Garry Bettman, the commissioner of the NHL, wants the Nets to move to the Prudential Center.

http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/hockey/islanders/blog/2009/04/gary_bettman_coliseum_unrealis.html#comments

Gary Bettman is a horrible commissioner. I honestly don’t care what his opinion is on the matter whether he agrees or disagrees with me. I think he’s done a horrible job with the NHL in the past five years or so as far as taking advantage of the stars of his sport and advertising. I struggle to find when playoff games are on and usually just watch NBA playoff games.

Anyway I without a doubt understand the part about tax payer dollars but to be perfectly honest, this would be one of the better projects our money is being spent on. Have you seen some of the things they’re spending tax payer money on in these bills they keep passing? Two examples that really stood out in my eyes were $60+ MILLION to grow grass in some area…that’s right, grass! The other one was nearly $100 million to move an insurance company into a new building…i’m sorry but those are absolutely absurd and i’m sure there are much worse things than that. I didn’t have the time to read each project and the cost. Spending money to help an arena get built that would benefit NY tremendously is much smarter than half of the things they’re spening our money on now. Money going back to the state like that would eventually help them build stronger schools and hospitals (which both NY and NJ desperately need). I know two wrongs don’t make a right and if your against the other things they’re spending money on then I can’t say anything and your right to oppose this, but if you don’t mind tens of millions going towards growing grass, then I find this very hypocritical.

If they’re willing to give Ratner money over hospitals and schools then you should be mad at the government. Is Ratner being a jerk by asking for it? Yeah but so are a lot of buinessmen who want to make big projects for the long term success.

I was also against that for the Jets Stadium planned for the West Side Yards that Woody Johnson wanted. I am not happy that both George Steinbrenner and Fred Wilpoon got the subsidies to build their new stadiums, which are already completed at the expense of us taxpayers. Any other private project that is using taxpayer dollars I am opposed such as what is going on at Willets Point and even for the Columbia expansion, so I am not just being selective on the Vanderbuilt Yards. The whole point of taxpayer dollars is that they are supposed to go to anything that is actually public to which what I mentioned is not. There are already a number of states and even cities that have passed laws forbidding it, but neither NYC or even NY is one of them that did that, which is why it can be done here.

Well then I understand why you would be upset if it went that way. Some people have no problem with this massive spending or just conveniently oppose spending tax payer dollars when they’re losing their basketball franchise.

you can’t spell argument. I’m not arguing opinions. the fact is, its been repeatedly said that we’re moving to brooklyn, while there has been minimal progress. have fun in bk. you’ll be the only one there.

Harold,

Some people have no problem spending other people’s money? Of course not, but that doesn’t mean it is right or moral. But alas, it is legal because of our corrupt politicians.

Hey what happened to my other post?

Even the rest of FCE is only putting projects in states and cities that don’t have those laws. The reason is because they all abuse emminent domain to build their projects no matter where. If they did try a state or city that had those laws, they would be disallowed in a heartbeat, which is why Ratner knows that no law exists here. If he did want the Nets to play in Seattle with a new arena, he would have to pay for it rather than the taxpayers that would for the one he plans in Brooklyn, because of those laws.