Grading the Nets

so i guess it isnt just me and about 85% of the fans who think frank didnt do a great job this year like some of you think.

already, the pundits have him graded with a C at best. which is one of the lower grades team wide. that should basically tell the story.

its time frabnmk takes a really good look at the mirror. at the beginning of this year, i knew the nets were going nowhere after seeing him implement that motion offense which was an absolute failure. i dont think anybody can argue with that. they were the worst opffensve team in almost every off. category before kifdd got traded. and that was with a team that had vc, rj, and kidd. once kidd got traded and harris came in, frank had no choice but to dump that motion offense crap in the garbage. what happened after that, the nets became one of the best offensive teamsa in the league and could score with anyone. but like with kidd and after kidd, the defense was non existent all year. which has to make you think either frank isnt a great defensive coach like some people think, or his players have stiopped pplaying hard for him, which is what defense is, playing hard. either one doesnt bode well for frank.

he better change everything about him bnext year, if he wants to remain the nest coach for more than 1/2 a year or a full year.

I thought you didn’t like any of those writers? Now you believe them? LOL

" which has to make you think either frank isnt a great defensive coach"
04-07, they were one of the better defensive teams in the league. So right there, it proves it’s the players.

The motion offense, it didn’t work because it was mostly RJ, but if you think about it, it looks just like the Princeton Offense, which was used since 2001.

HE DID WELL CONSIDERING EVERYTHING THAT WENT ON WITH THIS ORGANIZATION THIS YEAR.

Now a coach who should be fired is Flip Saunders. Ever since he took over for Larry Brown, the Pistons haven’t returned to the Finals. If Dumars can stand 3 years not reaching the Finals, Thorn can stand one year missing the playoffs.

the only think i like about frank is that he is consistent about his message: defense first. as we all know defense wins games and titles. our finals team was exciting and good because of the defense we played. that is why i am not really high on bringing boki and nenad back. if boki was more consistent on offense i wouldnt mind his lack of D, but he took a big step back this year. with krstic, i really dont like the idea of having a 7footer taking 15-20foot jumpers all game and who is not a good defender.

the problem is that when defense is not playing well, frank has to find a way to keep the team in the game offensively and not be stubborn and make in game changes. if you need to go more O then do it, sometimes you dont have the talent to impose a teams will upon another. sometimes you just gotta keep the flow going even if it is not something you want to do for a game.

wow kevin, you think that frank should keep his job and flip be fired. unbeleivable. what do you base his failures on. he has done a much better job than frank. howcome you are not assessing frank with the same criteria. at least he still has them win over 509 games each year, and reach the east finals each year. frank has took a finals team and put them in the lottery.

that statement proves in thing for me from you, you are just opinionated and is defintly a frank lover. i sid i would use that wotrd anymore, but i this isntant there is no choice.

flip makes frank look amateurish.

“HE DID WELL CONSIDERING EVERYTHING THAT WENT ON WITH THIS ORGANIZATION THIS YEAR”

did you not ever stop and think that maybe some of the = bad things that happened this yeart was because of frank’s coaching.

kevin, these are very weak points you make there. at least flip has his players play hard every single game for him. can you say the same thing for frank. it was your hero who quit on him first and decided that5 frank didnt have the stuff to make this team a contender. after saying this was the most talented team he’s been on, that pretty much takes thorn and his teammates out of the question of them being the reason why he wanted to leave. sayiung that the nest have no uiidentity, which is true, is a staright shot at frank.

good coaches are the ones who lay a strong foundation that when thiongs get tough the team is able to survuve. this team has no foundation, and the foundation that scott laid cracked this year. it did take a while since this was a veteran team, but it woyuld only be so long.

tgood coaches implement a style of play whther its off. or def accoriding to his player personnel. frank has had his core for a while now, so he should of known something about his players. he should of known that the motion offense was gonna be a failure, which it was.

kevin you’ve had many rifdiculous comments, but this one about flip being fired and frank not being fired compared to flip, is the most ridiculous one to datre. before you sit and write something, it would be a good idea to sit dowm and think about it.

Unbelievable! These people make a living writing about basketball and they are totally clueless. Didn’t any of you watch any of the games? You guys – even Hollinger, whose opinion I once valued – didn’t notice that Frank’s “coaching” and Harris and Carter’s “leadership” took the Nets straight to the lottery? Then you have Frank benching SWAT and playing Boki major minutes (who played in spite of a bad back – - -WHY? the games didn’t mean anything. He stunk the place out, in any case). . . And the B.S. about the Nets playing well against Milwaukee – - – wow! we beat one of the 3 worst teams in the NBA – - – playing without half its starters, and we managed to win. Joke. KEEPING FRANK WILL COST THE NETS A LOT MORE $ than eating his salary would – you think the swamp was empty THIS year? With NO national TV dates . . . next year NBDL league teams will make more than the NETS will.

“04-07, they were one of the better defensive teams in the league. So right there, it proves it’s the players.”

kevin- what about this year. and last year they wernt so great defensively i moight add. how come you didnt complete the sentence i worte. i wrote that either frank isnt a good defenisve coach or his players arnt responding to him, its one or the other.

he had the same group of guys and the same core the beginning of this year as 04-07. why didnt they play defense, they sucked defensively. and after upgrading harris for kidd, and diop for colluns, both defensive upgrades, they were the same, awful defensively.

so what happened this year. tyou cant blame the defense oin kidd wanting to be traded.

in those previous years, frank had veteran players, who already knew how to play defense. good defensive coaches just dont preach defense, and only have veterans play defense. they teach their defensive principles to each player on the team. and no matter who comes or goes the coach has a system in place, defensively. look at the clets. they have guys like eddie hgouse and sam cassell playing defense now.

defense is not a skill, even though it helps to bve athletic, which the nets have oplenty of. its taught. its effort.

you know if they were mediocre this year on defense, then yea your comment could be taken in consideration, but they sucked, one of the worst in the league. part of it is frank’s pack the paint mentality. that school of thought was great about 5 yrs ago when it wwas struictly a big men’s game. but now this is a shooters league. guys will burn if not contested. the nets got burned by the 3 all year long. the nets are tthe worst 3pt defensive team in the league. also when they defend pick n roll offense, the big man never hedges to the sghooter and contests his hots. he sags off leaving the shopoter wide open, and leaving his teammte to get burned by the pick. also the nets don not know when to help or not. they often help for no reason leaving the defense to crumble. also the nets rotation defense is extremely poor. and also their communication defense is poor. also playing small put alot of pressure on the defense. the nets often gave up wayu too many offensive rebounds and seconfd chance poiunts cause of frank’s affinity of playing small. tams who ;play small like pheonix and the warriors have al harrington and shawn marion, not anymore, at the 4 and they could legitametly play both positions. playing small also left the paint easy to attack.

the nest defenislvely were bad in every aspect. that goes further then to say it ws the players. franbk’s decisions this year were not very good. all he can do is learn from his mistakes and go forward. cause if he doesnt, he will be fired, you can put that in the bank.

Pat Riley – PAY ATTENTION! The Nets think they just need a “big” to be great: give them Marion for RJ and Marcus Williams . Then, if you can draft Beasley . . . evem if you can’t, with RJ and DWade and Udonis add a REAL point guard – - – Marcus takes you back to contention. The Nets? No concept of TEAM – all Stupor Stars.

Considering the available coaches this year there’s no reason to fire Frank with all that went up this year . Especially when he just has been extended.

actually stevie, this year is a year with alot of good FA coahces around. larry brown, van gundy, carlisle, skiles. these are all coaches who have better track records than frank.

every year there will be challenges. you cant expect to have a smooth sailing year, its just not gonna happen.

the coach has to be prepared for whatver happens and has his team ready to play regardless. too many times the team seemed disinterested and played with no passion, effort, or fight.

yes frank did get extended last year. thorn thought he had a nucleus in place for the nest 3 yrs with frank, vc, kidd, and rj, with the kids. but things happened, and frank has o be ready for them. eddie jordan was, so was cheeks who had his former gm fires, and has lame duck status.

the only viable reason why i see thorn not firing frank is because of the extention. how bad would he look in front of ratner. no matter what people in the business are prideful. thorn isnt about to throw away 9 mill. what he’s gonna do i think, is give frank another shot at it, but on a very tight leash. if the same problems are recurring, then it is the coach no doubt abot it. the team cant afford another playoff’less season, and taking another hit in attendence this year. so if frank doesnt do well to start the season, thorn would then only owe him one year left and change, which is much less a loss business wise than not making the playoffs and not putting a good product oomn the floor which will affect attendance.

frank is still alive, but the question will be for how long. especially with kiki here, you know he is itching to put his stamp on this team. you could tell he isnt really on the same page with frank with some fo hte trades he made. usually before making trades the gm conmsults the coach, and they usually have to be on the same page. i dont think frank would of agreed on the colins trade, and the add ons in the kidd trade which were allen and wright. collins, allen and wright were franks top 3 off the becnh and they even started some games. so frank is on the hot seat going into nmext year. frank saud that not making the playoffs will not happen again, so lets see if he’s all talk or not.

also if they put a super product out there and the teams ends up barely making the plyoffds and getting an early exit, that will be considered a failure in thorn’s and kii’s eyes.

for frank next year, it will be the most importrant year of his career. cause i just dont see any other teams making him their head coach. and even at the collegiate level where its all about player develo-ment. we all know frank has no trust and patience with youngsters, and isnt the greatest player developer, so hgis head coaching career scould be in flux. persnally i dont hate the guy, i actiually want him to succeed so the nets can succeed, but this year i didnt like the way he coached regardless of what hapned. his in game decisions were very questionable.

I think the only grade that matter is Kidd’s

F

b/c that’s what he did to us. Can I write F’ed us?

P.s. Nice DAVID: stupor stars!

larry brown, van gundy, carlisle, skiles are not coaches you have success with if you have Vince Carter on your team .

Especially Skiles and Carlisle since they’re grind out coaches and thats not going to work with a guy like Vince.

I am thinking hard where The Nets team will end up with Frank at the helm and sadly I see no future with this guy. His glaring negative is with young players. Dismal record. Boone? This guy is intelligent with very high basketball IQ and came from a very program. I was thinking why go to the draft if Frank is still the coach. They just all going to be ruined. Even guys with experience coming from NBDL has no hope with this guy. Now I realize why Boston re-signed Doc Rivers. I also now realized that modern young players respond better wtih coaches that has credibility. I don’t mean likes of Skiles, Carisle or Suitcase Brown. These people never had actually won any championship as players. Look at Byron Scott. Players respect him because he has won as a player. In this trend of thought I would go out on a limb to suggest that the best coach for the Nets is BILL LAIMBEER. Think about it. He has won championships. He had coached a winning Women’s basketball team and he will have very good credibilty among present day players ’cause he hsd done it.

How is it a ridiculous statement? Larry Brown brought a championship to Detroit. Flip can’t even bring them back to the Finals. At least they play hard every game? True, but that’s not an accomplishment, especially for the Pistons.

I completely agree with mina. The reality is frank was given a good team which he brought to ruin…Just to list out some of his mistakes:

-motion offense which took carter out of rhytm for an entire season
-does anyone remember how many games the nets lost starting Collins + Allen
-the premature return of Kristic
-not playing magloire at all
-not giving Boone the start from the get-go
-not playing enought of Sean
-not instilling confidence in M Williams
-playing Boki heart for no apparent reason

One Thing don’t bring up Magloire he’s not seeing a single minute in Dallas and they don’t even have a backup Center besides him . He just sucks get over it and it was right to not play him .

i want to take a little time to give Frank some praise.up until te middle of last season Frank did a good job.he had this team playing some type of cognent flowing zone-D that shut teams down.Last season i thought that there were 3 fundamental teams(Spurs,Pistons,Nets) & that one of them would win the championship.and they did.somewere down that road,frank lost the team.rebuilding for Frank is crazy!!!.right now its safe for Thorn to do something about the situiation.he’ll be in more trouble if Frank can’t recover this team. i myself think that he can, but still don’t believe he,s the one to get us over that hump. as for Brown the man cost too much and plays too many mental games with the players(that always start nice but finish bad) carlialse teams can be figured out and a team will have that slight edge. kiles is a ? to me,don’t know much about him.
  I think that the best thing for this team is to stay pat.Draft donte Greene & chase Budinger and see how they all gel.

“does anyone remember how many games the nets lost starting Collins + Allen”

I do. Six. And they won six. Their record with a starting frontline of Collins and Allen (6-6) was better than their record when not starting Collins and Allen (28-42).

I posted this three days ago, but I realize that the truth often gets lost around here.

“For the record, Collins and Allen started 12 games together, and the Nets were 6-6 in those games.

They were 5-2 in the first seven games they started together, including road wins over the Blazers, Lakers and Cavs.

They also lost to the Knicks twice, and the Grizzlies and Clippers at home with those two starting."

Lousy grades. I think VC deserves an “A” or an “A-”. RJ get’s a "B’, Kidd gets a Fat F. Oh he’s traded. My bad.

For a coach that preaches defense first, this team has played little of that in the past 2-3 seasons.

Actually thats not true the defense was ok the last years the offense stunk. Now they traded away some of the better defensive players while not getting much better on Offense .

grades and comments are RELATIVE to individual capabilities(CURRENT capabilities, not future potential) and take into account injuries … former nets are not graded

van horn … A+ … agreed to the trade, didn’t show up

boone … A- … great effort & attitude, still has upside

carter … A- … big numbers despite injury, great finish

jefferson … B … great offense, mediocre defense

harris … B … great offense, mediocre defense

diop … B … great d, mediocre rebounding, unwatchable o

swift … B … good attitude, highlight reel, had moments

sean … B- … up & down, hurt most by kidd’s departure

hassell … C+ … great 1st game, went downhill from there

armstrong … C+ … underutilized, NOT his fault

nachbar … C- … played scared, bit the apple all season

marcus … D+ … a few good games, otherwise sucked

krstic … D … see nachbar comments, but even worse

ager … incomplete … rode the pine, great attitude

thorn … D … kidd deal saved him from being an F-
 
frank … D … work ethic saved him from being an F-

ratner … F … for screwing both new york & new jersey

And the silver lining….

The best thing about this year is that Thorn has to change things. He has to be open to everything. He can’t even dream about bringing them back and see what we can do mentality that he had last year. Failure exposed all the flaws and there is no way to ignore them now. They need too much to think maybe with Carter, RJ and Harris we can go far if we just get another shooter. No, everyone should be on the trading block to reshape this team. Who cares if Carter and RJ want to come back and want each other….. If they can be moved to reshape this team, then move them

what do you guys think of R.J & swift for Chris Jeffries & Zack Randolf.not a fan Of Zack but he has the skills.i think jeffries would be a better fit in Jersey than he was in N.Y. then we can add Greene & maybe Brandon Rush but prefurably Chase Budinger.

No Zach is expensive and doesn’t help his team in any kind of way + Jefferies is one of the worst contracts in the leageau .

I rather keep RJ and buy Swift out then this .