Damn I’m good, I said that we might not move to BK, and not to put all our bets on that and what happens. BAM

eh w.e i guess we gonna stay in jersey hopefully lebron still comes but thats probably not happening now

It wasn’t happening in the first place. LeBron said he was staying in Cleavland a while ago.

They will get it done…….eventually. The Nets need to be in Brooklyn

good
now what they should do is play in one of the best arenas ive ever seen at the rock . that way a lot more fans would actully go. and who knows maybe lebron would like it there if not who cares il take bosh wade dirk tmac or any of the other free agents. so no barry they dont need to move any were ( out of NJ) they just need to stop telling people they r moving in 2009 or 2010 so people actuly start going to games. what a joke this thing is

Not much news in this other than a few comments by experts. Everything else has been reported. I expect a response tomorrow.

But one thing that AP doesnt report amidst all its questioning of how the credit crisis will effect the arena is this: Ratner was able to secure $1.5 billion worth of financing—all of it with some state help—for two projects within a mile of the arena site. Critics can talk all they want about how the financing is not the same, but getting $1.5 billion of financing in this market is remarkable.

Also, note the last line: official expects it to get done.

I hate critics. Rats!

yeah, and you know that anonymous “officials” always tell it like it is.

Nets won’t be moving I said it since the news started & I stand by it. Ratner is lose finanical stablility daily and soon will be his support you think the people supporting him pockets won’t be hurting soon either? I respect “Nets Income” post I like his knowledge and his post approach but I have to agree with “Issac & Brooklyn Bob” when it comes to this NJ to BK movement.

Bleah this is the last straw.
I was fine with the move to Brooklyn as it would have easily secured us a top notch 2010 free agent but now that AT BEST we’ll be there a year after the ground breaking FA class there’s really no point in the Barcylas arena anymore.
Really now one more year in the Izod center is gonna be horrible for us!

Sell the Nets to the Devils ownership Rathner or move the Nets to the Rock and get this BS over with!!!

Move the Nets to Newark!

I actually attended that court case that made the ruling. I was very happy to hear the outcome that the case can proceed. According to the verdict on the appeal, the judges believe that the Empire State Developement was being selective on the blight study. Also, the judges will allow for another hearing at around March of next year. I say that Bruce Ratner should just ditch this plan and have the Nets play in Newark instead.

NETS = NEWARK = JAY Z = LEBRON = CHAMPIONSHIP.

To correct Tal Barzilai, there was no verdict yet on the blight study. There are two court cases. In one, there was a hearing on the legitimacy of the environmental review, including the blight study. That decision is pending.

The only “decision” that has come down recently is a decision in a separate case (involving a challenge to eminent domain) to deny an effort by the state of NY to get the case dismissed. All that means is that the case will be heard.

I’ll agree with NetIncome that most of this article isn’t new, and that the last line is important.

I’ll disagree that Ratner’s capacity to get Liberty Bonds for the Beekman Tower has anything to do with Atlantic Yards (other than, perhaps, a skill at working the system).

Lets look at this Logically for a second..

Ratner owns a real-estate development business. What is the main reason why the US is in a recession right now? Subprime Mortgages, aka THE REAL ESTATE INDUSTRY.

Barclays is expected to supply a substantial amount of money towards the project through the rights to the proposed arena’s name. What is Barclays? a BANK. And last I checked, their cost per share was around $17, which is $33 dollars lower than a year ago.

Both situations don’t help the cause here.

I hear Newark knocking on the door..

What Net Income doesn’t say in the above post is that the bonds Ratner was able to secure were government backed Liberty Bonds that were issued to help out NYC in the aftermath of 9/11 ($1.5 billion worth). They were not issued by a private firm. Those bonds were limited, and none were ever issued for the Atlantic Yards project. Also, these bonds were secured well before the stock market plummetted, and well before the credit freeze began. Don’t believe anything Net Income says. He or she is clearly partisan, and is not interested in telling the truth or what happens to the NEW JERSEY Nets.

Also, the $400 million dollars that is to be paid to Ratner for the naming rights by Barclays Bank is contingent upon all financing being in place by the end of November. Since a decision from the IRS on tax-exempt bonds is not expected by then, the arena portion of the project is in all intents and purposes, Kaput!

Nets to Newark in ‘09-’10!!!

Mr T -
show me the report that says the naming rights agreement is contingent on financing being in place by the end of November…Even Norman would say that is not true.

Norman Oder is right on the rulig, but either way, the fight is not over yet especially when one of them was ruled to continue the hearings for a later date.

@ Brooklyn Zoo,

Does it even matter at this point? The original claim was to have the arena operating by 2006. ’Nuff said!

LETS GO TO NEWARK!

MrT
it does matter when you state facts that aren’t true.
As NetIncome, and Norman both said, the article doesn’t show anything new…The project has been pushed back again, but hey that’s real-estate development on a grand scale in new york for you.
Please – if you are going to say things on this board, make sure they are correct. There has NEVER been documentation that Barclays will “pull out” without a groundbreaking in November.
Yea, the original claim was to have the arena in 06, look, crap happens. Bottom line for the Nets is that FCRC, the Nets investors and employees are as dedicated to this project as ever.
While DDDB wants the project stopped, they still have a long uphill battle. That my friend is a fact.

@ Brooklyn Zoo,

Here’s the article. Paste this into your browser. Go to the middle of the article. Note that this an NY Times article, who have past business ties to FCR.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/10/nyregion/10yards.html

It’s as if the supporters have been sleeping over the past month. Show me how in this economy this arena will get paid for.

I can think of one way – Ratner pays out of pocket. Nah, let’s just use taxpayer money to kick the taxpayers out of their homes for below market value prices. That might have flied in 2005, but not 2008-2009.

@ Brooklyn Zoo,

You seem to be too emotionally attached to this topic. You and Net Income spout half truths and spin on this blog all the time, yet the rest of us put up with you, b/c you feel the need to be read. So please don’t try to call me out on facts that may be in question. Have you read the article yet? Here’s the quote, in case you or any of the other readers haven’t read it yet.

“One reason Mr. Ratner may be forging ahead is his deal with Barclays Bank, which officials say provides him with $20 million a year for naming the arena after it. The naming rights contract requires Forest City to close on the land and the financing by the end of November.”

This is not spin. It’s from a pro-Ratner periodical. I think the Borough of Brooklyn would be a good place for a b-ball team. That b-ball team is the NY Knicks, who already play within the city limits. Not the NJ Nets, whom most Brooklynites probably never knew existed until 2001. I’ve been a Net fan for nearly 20 years, and I’ve been following the arena saga since early 1999, when the Nets were originally trying to build in Newark, NOT Brooklyn. There was no opposition to the idea from David Stern. He actually wanted it to happen, but was exasperated when political officials gummed up the works. Now an arena is ready and waiting, and Stern is probably pulling strings behind the scenes to get Newark on the table, so this BK fiasco can finally end.

MrT
thanks for backing up what you said.
Now – do you think that the Nets/FCRC and Barclays have measures in place in case something like this would have happened..a delay

Brooklyn Zoo,

In a word… NO. This entire project is a giant patch of wool pulled over the eyes of BK residents, and the public at large. All of this uncertainty helps lower property values and force residents to move, all under the guise of Nets b-ball and affordable housing. Unfortunately, I don’t believe the project (in it’s current adaptation) was ever going to come to fruition. Now that the credit crisis has doomed the project, his only other option is downtown Newark. Building an arena over railyards (security issue) for a total of $950 million is nothing short of insane! Arenas are cost-effective, up to a point. After $500 million or so, it doesn’t make any sense to go ahead and build them because the debt service on such a facility would be too high to ever actually realize a profit.

You don’t have to like the notion the Nets may move, but in any economy, that SOME major real estate development at that location in Brooklyn is going to happen – the city wants an anchor to that part of Brooklyn, as it has long been one of the city’s biggest subway hubs. That Ratner owns both the location and an NBA team means he will wait if he has to.

NEW JERSEY NETS!!! Enough said!

now were not getting lebron why would he want to play at the run down meadowlands. there would have to be a major renevation to get him to play. i guess anthony now

Go south guys,10 miles and you will find hard,concrete secure stability at the ROCK

 
To the present ownership of the nets, PLEASE sell the team to somebody that is really devoted to the team

I have commented a few times recently on Barclays recent woes. It now appears that it is taking measures to avoid a govt bail out. There will be a couple of offerings to private investors to raise capital. And there will be no dividend paid out for the current quarter.

So perhaps the naming rights deal is not quite unthinkable. However, it seems to me it would be more sensible to just put the name on the Lehman building just purchased and get a luxury suite at an arena offering both bball and hockey for more entertainment options.

They cannot have a groundbreaking if they didn’t already demolish where the arena is suppossed to go, which happens to be the building where Daniel Goldstien lives, the founder of Develope Don’t Destroy Brooklyn.

@ Moe,

I respectfully disagree with you in this because in such an economy, it is imperative that well thought out, realistic projects be developed. This project does not fall into that category. I am against the Atlantic Yards project for two reasons. The first is that the team I have rooted for over the last 18 years is threatening to leave to an area where there is lukewarm support for the team and 2)angry residents/ businesses are getting the shaft for something that is not in the public goodh, and more than likely will not deliver on the benefits promised to the community by the developer.

No one seems to point out these days that the placement of the arena will make it a threat for a terrorist attack. In Newark, the Prudential Center was built too close to the curb, and the police now close the two streets closest to the entrances during events. However, it is not on the main intersection in downtown Newark. In Brooklyn, the arena would also be too close to the curb, and sits on the intersection of Atlantic and Flatbush, meaning that the main crossing in downtown BK would need to be closed off during events. This would hurt downtown BK, not help it.

The last point I’d like to reiterate from my earlier posts is the $950MM (more than $1 billion by the end of construction) of the arena. That price is far from cost-effective for a professional sports team, when the average price to build an arena falls b/t $200-$300MM. Granted, it is more expensive to build in the metro area, but that still does not justify the outrageous price tag. If there is any lag in luxury suite sales, or if the naming rights deal is jeopardized (see my above post), Ratner will more than likely come out of pocket to make debt payments, making his purchase of the team a money loser. Meanwhile, a new arena sits in Newark, with willing ownership and city and state gov’t that is amenable to the Nets joining them.

How do you know the Devils ownership is “willing” to buy the Nets? – if Ratner sells it is going to be to the highest bidder, and it could be from Vegas or Seattle before it is NJ…

@ Brooklyn Zoo,

Highly unlikely it would be from those two cities, b/c Newark already has a new NBA ready arena in place. Vegas is risky (unlikely) b/c of the gambling influence (see Tim Donaghy), and the Sonics left Seattle b/c the city wasn’t willing to renovate the existing arena there, or build a new one. You’re right; the Devils may not want to buy the Nets, but maybe there could be joint ownership, or if Ratner buys the Devils and moves them to the Rock. This is all speculation, but its’ sound speculation, IMO.

@ Brooklyn Zoo,

When I wrote “or if Ratner buys the Devils and moves them to the Rock”, them refers to the Nets.

When NJ first “lost” the Nets to Ratner, they acknowledged that they were asleep at the wheel and should have done more to retain the team. In the interim, we have seen a new top of the line sports arena built in Newark with great access and lots of events. Now look at one of the best booked arenas, the Staples Center. Keeping the Nets in NJ would be a huge plus for financially supporting the Rock, keeping revenue in state, and attracting people to NJ for sports. This is a window of opportunity for someone to buy back/buy out Ratner, but the other stipulation that I read was that for the Nets to play in Newark, they must be coowned by the arena operator long term. That’s an NBA rule that I read on this site once upon a time.

It’s now or never to get the Nets back before we lose them to another city somewhere. My tune on this for the past few months has been to just bring this to a resolution, because in the end, the team and fans are the ones who are suffering. If we knew that the Nets were 100% staying, I think the RJ deal wouldn’t have gone down…

Ratner’s naming rights deal with barclays DOES require that he have financing in place by november 30th.

That obviously won’t happen due to the ongoing legal delays.

Barclays’ public statement that it is committed to supporting ratner’s project is meaningless chatter.

Sort of like ratner saying in 2005 that he was committed to winning b-ball and that he made a mistake by trying to cut costs with the k-mart deal.

Talk is cheap. Actions speak far louder.

Once the contract escape clause kicks in on december 1st, i expect barclays to either bail on ratner completely or demand a substantial renegotiation of the naming rights deal.

Barclays holds all the cards and has all the leverage. Ratner has none due to the scarcity of potential naming rights sponsors in the current economy.

Brooklyn Bob just hit the nail on the head. The project is already dead, before it has been officially declared dead. Ratner ‘s talk about commitment is lip service b/c he has investors to answer to, and politicians who have to save face. In the end, I’m certain he will blame the inability to get the arena built on the credit/ financial crisis, which is partially true. However, its’ also true that community opposition, rising costs, and a half-baked development plan contributed to this project being shelved.

“HE [MARC GANIS, THE SPORTS FINANCE EXPERT FROM CHICAGO] AND OTHERS THINK RATNER WILL EVENTUALLY SUCCEED.”

Unfortunately, the a.p. writer did not attach any direct quotes to that statement.

Those are the writer’s words above, not marc ganis’s words.

That’s classic editorializing in the guise of objective reporting.

But that’s nothing new for a.p. reporters. They’re about as objective as bathroom graffiti is.

You’d think with the economy tanking as is, Ratner would have better things to spend his money on other than paying people to shill for his dead project on a Nets blog.

Good point, morpheus.

Also consider that the last thing in the world ratner would do is publicly declare that atlantic yards is dead, even if it’s dead as a doornail.

Atlantic Yards gives ratner EXTRA LEVERAGE when he enters into negotiations to move to newark or to sell the team.

Creating a fire-sale atmosphere is NOT a good negotiating strategy for ratner.

The big question now is will Ratner pay back the New Jersey fans that have been coming to see his product since 2004 despite him telling those people he had no use for them by trying to move the team. Will he do right by us by finding an amicable deal with the city of Newark and the investors that would hopefully save the New Jersey Nets?

@ mr dollar bills

Sad, but true. Well said.

I am not going to repeat what I have already mentioned about Bruce Ratner’s history, so I suggest anyone clicking the link to the previous topic about him if they haven’t already read it.

http://www.netsdaily.com/?p=6549

The Rock is a beautiful arena but let’s not get a circle jerk going just yet. Even with Devils now controlling all of their home dates (more weekend games) nothing has happened to change their poor attendance and media exposure. If anything, in another 2/3 years we might have solid evidence proving that The Rock is not The Answer.

Brooklyn Johhny,

Frist of all, nice language!
Secondly, while I agree with you about the lack of media exposure, where do you get your info about poor attendance? From my understanding, attendance is up about 10% from the Devils’ last year at Izod to their 1st year at the Rock. And that is while losing some of the season ticket base that didn’t want them to leave Izod.

“If anything, in another 2/3 years we might have solid evidence proving that The Rock is not The Answer.”

The answer to what? Are you still under the delusion that Ratner is trying to move the Nets for attendance reasons & not real estate ones?

Unless any of you, who support him, happen to be either his business associates, CEOs, or stockholders, Bruce Ratner will owe you nothing. The truth is that the he only cares about himself most of the time and couldn’t think less about others. This is why a member of the South Oxford Block Associtation said at a hearing that he is no saviour but really a developer. As for Lebron James, trying to acquire for him has nothing to do with the team moving to Brooklyn. If he chooses not to be on the Nets, it won’t be because the move didn’t happen, it will be because the deal of getting him there didn’t go through well. Also, I never heard Lebron James say he will only play for the Nets if they move to Brooklyn.

The devils’ attendance increased by 10% since moving to the rock … AND THAT’S DESPITE MASSIVE TICKET PRICE INCREASES.

The seton hall pirates’ attendance increased by 20% since moving to the rock.

If the nets’ attendance increased by 20% over last year’s 15,700 per game average, they would regularly sell out the 18,500 seats in the rock.

Last year’s 15,700 per game average was actually down from a 17,000 per game average in 2006-2007. It would only take a 10% increase from 17,000 to regularly sell out the rock.

If the nets moved to the rock, attendance and revenues would skyrocket and they wouldn’t lose players such as rj, mikki moore and eddie house due to financial constraints.

Moving to the rock is a complete no-brainer for the nets. It would be great for the fans, great for the players, great for the franchise, great for newark and great for new jersey.
  
COMMISSIONER STERN NEEDS TO STOP THE MADNESS AND FORCE THE NETS TO MOVE TO THE ROCK!!!